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So unless people adopt your line of thinking they have no idea what they're talking about? Superiority complex much?

As long as your first, first round pick isn't #10 or later. At that point it would take a lot more than your two first round picks to move up into the top 5.

Are you excluding yourself from that group of scrubs? If so you need as mirror. Having a superiority complex is not attractive.


When all else fails, bow out and blame others because in your heart you know none of this is kosher. The party of personal responsibility no longer exists.

You can't in good faith defend what's going on and somehow that's the fault of others. It seems to be a theme among your kind these days. Carry on.

I really want to disagree with Scott here, but with the inexperienced QB (as you mentioned), and the subpar performance of the Oline, it is very difficult to form an accurate opinion. But to me, our offensive playcalling appears very basic (of necessity?) and unimaginative. (And to boot, I am an amateur in any event....lol).

Thanks, I appreciate it 🤙🏽

Easy there,,, Purp does this pretty much on his own nickel... Demanding isn't nice in this case....

Ahh the old run and hide thing... Seen a lot of that lately from the likes of Mike Johnston... It's become part of the MAGA playbook

You might be right Peen. You could equally be incorrect. There's not a lot to go on.

I guess my biggest take aways are that there are cover ups across the board - both sides of the policital spectrum, the rich and pwerful and people in positions of influence. That was Epstein's M.O. - he was networking before 'networking' became a buzzword.

With that said - personally what I have seen and know as fact, there is a 2003 50th 'book' that was assembled by Ghislaine Maxwell long, long before Trump aspired to be POTUS.... in it there is a "poem" by Trump and a sketch and signed by Trump. The idea that this was planted 20+ years ago as a 'gtcha' to Trump is idiotic. Even for someone that likes to call Democrats Commies, you have to know in your heart that the note was written by Trump and it absolutely indicated to any rati nale individual with a brain that Trump knew all about Epstein's secrets and between the note and numerous first hand accounts of the girls who were abused by Epstein, Trump partook of those "services" .... another fact is that Ghislaine Maxwell is a monster who deserves to serve every second of her sentance. BUT Trump's cronnies interviewed her, she made some statements and agreed not to incriminate Trump .... and has since (like a week later) moved to a minimum security prison.

If you think that's kosha - either the note from 2003. Or Ghislaine Maxwell being moved to a minimum security prison after suddenly being interviewed by Deputy U.S. Attorney General Todd Blanche ... there's something seriously wrong.

If these QB's do return to school this coming years QB class is turning into what the past years class was like. One really good prospect, Mendoza and a bunch of question marks. In 2025's class it was Ward and a bunch of question marks. If Shedeur doesn't work out it looks like our best bet would be the '27 class. Trading down and getting an extra #1 for '27 makes sense same as we did last April.

If in fact Moore returns to school.

The 2027 draft will have.

Manning
Sellers
Moore
Sayin
Lagway (Florida)
CJ Carr (ND)
Ty Simpson (if he returns to school)
John Mateer (if he returns this year)

Trading back this year will accomplish a dual purpose.

Shedeur will have two full years with the Browns. They should have a damn near a complete picture of his true potential.

If Shedeur proves himself the team is in great shape to really build around him.

If he struggles the Browns will have insurance with two first picks and a stacked class to find another guy.

It could prove to be the best case scenario.

Good breakdown, as always.

I mean this in all sincerity the history of the NFL is rich in culture.

Do a deep dive and research the history of two giant families in football history.

Paul Brown and Art Rooney.

Look at the years they won and lost. Find out why. Those families had all the culture you could want.

You’re proving my point again probably without realizing it.

You need it all. Pat, Andy, a competent GM, a good owner and all the rest.

A winning culture is something you build on day by day, season by season. You simply don’t get a winning culture after three wins per season. (the Browns way)
It’s when you have a winning culture you start to win division titles and Super Bowls, not the other way around.

Sounds logical if you spend some time thinking about it.

You need a competent general manager to draft the next Pat Mahomes or similar.

It can take time but a good owner is patient. Do you get the sense that our owner is patient?
Do you trust our general manager to find the next elite quarterback prospect?
Do you have trust in Stefanski developing and nurturing a young unpolished diamond?

Ask yourself what’s the Browns past history drafting and developing young quarterbacks?

Our GM drafted Dillon Gabriel and Shedeur, signed and traded Flacco and Pickett. That’s only in 2025.

In 2022 our owner together with his other yes sayers signed a sexual predator and gave him 230m guaranteed. Despite all the alarming bells and that Watson rejected Cleveland in the first place. How dumb can anyone be!?

The Browns don’t have the infrastructure to make all these decisions right.
That’s a fact and the last six seasons tells the story. If you don’t believe in me check the results.

Do you honestly think that disastrous results is all because of only bad luck?

This roster is build by Andrew Berry. The good and the bad. It’s because of him that we have a quarterback carousel the last four seasons.
Our results are by large down to Kevin Stefanski. Nobody expect him to win 17 games a season but 3 wins/season 2 years in a row is unacceptable in his position.

The Browns first need to start with getting the decisions right, that’s the first step. Not the other way around.
For that you need competent leaders.

It does sound familiar, GM.....lol

I really don't want to break this down fully tonight (honestly I don't want to at all).
However...

Broncos
Seahawks
Patriots
Bears
Jaguars
Bills
49ers
Rams
Texans
Chargers

These are the top ten best records in the NFL currently. "We probably need elite on 6-7 positions, probably more." Per your quote...please name 6-7 elite players on their teams. One common denominator between all these teams is two things: 1. Their starting QBs have played the whole year or almost all of it. 2. Their QBs have played at a top level the whole year.

These teams do not have 6-7 elite players. They have a couple top players at certain positions with high end QB'ing.

What our team is lacking is a QB making veteran plays or key reads. Want an example? This past game...4th quarter, 4th and 2 we have the ball on our 43 yard line. Quick three step drop, Fannin runs a speed out. He is the main target and the first read. He's open off the break. Throw it the moment he breaks...first down. Sanders stares at it and doesnt pull the trigger. Sack. Game over.

Tom Brady....Patrick Mahomes makes that throw all day. However, a rookie QB still developing may or may not. In the future, he learns from this....or he doesn't. That is the tough part about trying to develop a QB. He will sink or swim. Patience is involved. This happens with a high percentage of QB's in their first season no matter where they are drafted.

It has been interesting watching the All-22 this year. I highly recommend getting a subscription if you have 10 dollars to spare a month and have the time to watch weekly. In my time watching, seeing the plays called by Stef then called by Rees has been night and day. There have been receivers open (no matter how bad or good you think the WRs are) on a high percentage of plays. The issues mostly has been on of the three: 1. WR drops the ball, QB misses the read or the play is blown up instantly b/c of the OL.

Edit: I want to be the first on this site to give props to Rees and his play calling this year. He hasn't been perfect (I don't expect any play caller to be), however he's been very solid. I really hope we can keep him. He's done an excellent job of running the same formations and building different plays (run and pass) off of them.

Peen,
I understand your point. Your point is solid. I agree if Mendoza is significantly better than Moore...and goes crazy this playoff then I don't disgree with you at all. What I will say if both are about the same in evaluating (like i said early opinion) 1a...1b stuff. Mendoza is 22 years old, born Oct 1 2003. Dante Moore 20 years old, born May 4th 2005. My opinion...they will choose Dante being he has similar attributes and can possibly have a higher ceiling being a year and half younger.

That is an extra year and half to develop their passer. If 2027 is their target date, he can sit an extra year behind Sanders and learn/develop.

For an organization who hasn’t won anything in decades I think we should be careful when we criticize or downplay organizations who’re much more successful than us.
We’re not in a position to lecture anyone about culture and winning mentality.

Our record the last two seasons are 26 losses and counting with Stefanski and Berry.
Whenever somebody defend a HC and a GM with that record, criticize other successful teams and act like they have all the answers then the only logical conclusion is that they have absolutely now idea what they talking about.

Without Mahomes there is no culture.

Without Mahomes Andy doesn't win Super Bowls.

Without wins there is no winning culture.

Why can you not understand the facts?

The usual scrubs talking like they know what they are talking about.


Carry on.....I'm out of here, and not for reason some will claim.

Depends if you hit the lung... So yeah, it can. I've had it done. For me, it didn't work.... But yeah, done wrong, it can be dangerous. But don't take my word for it.. Google it.

"It seems you are trying to indicate that they all gave the DOJ an "impossible task". And somehow that's partly the fault of democrats?


Woooo there big fella, I'm not saying that at all...you need to get your timeline meter fixed. That vote you refer too took place around the 19th of Nov. I'm talking about the fact they've had these documents for YEARS.., So yeah, to some extent, that does fall on Democrat and Republicans alike....

Yeah, it's too bad that they would have not only all of their other picks and FA's this year to build a team around a QB, but at least a couple of more seasons without the watson salary cap strangle hold on them to do so. If the last draft is any indication of their improved ability to draft players it isn't unlikely they could do that.

But your blind negativity gets in the way of admitting that.

But then again Peen you may have a point. There are those over one million documents related to Epstein they claimed to have magically found they idea even existed AFTER the deadline. Like that's a real thing.

DOJ says it has found over a million additional documents potentially related to Epstein

The Justice Department on Wednesday said it has uncovered over a million more documents potentially related to the Jeffrey Epstein case and may need “a few more weeks” to review and release them to the public.

The department made the revelation in a post on X, saying the the US Attorney for the Southern District of New York and the FBI had informed the department of the new documents.

“The DOJ has received these documents from SDNY and the FBI to review them for release, in compliance with the Epstein Files Transparency Act, existing statutes, and judicial orders,” the post said.

“We have lawyers working around the clock to review and make the legally required redactions to protect victims, and we will release the documents as soon as possible. Due to the mass volume of material, this process may take a few more weeks. The Department will continue to fully comply with federal law and President Trump’s direction to release the files,” the post continued.

The announcement on Wednesday comes after a week of intermittent releases as required by a new transparency law that Congress passed last month. The department already had been facing criticism for not releasing everything as required on December 19, though officials insisted they needed time to redact information to protect victims and alleviate other possible legal concerns.

Even before the revelation Wednesday of more possible documents, the Justice Department had been scrambling to get out everything in its possession. CNN reported Tuesday that Justice Department leadership had asked for volunteers in a prosecutor’s office in South Florida to help with redactions.

The Justice Department first posted a massive trove of documents required to be released under the new law on the Friday deadline. That was followed up with another drop early Saturday, and another major release on Tuesday, which contained several notable references to President Donald Trump.

A bipartisan array of lawmakers and a growing number of survivors of Epstein’s abuse have criticized the Trump administration’s rollout of the documents. Some have raised questions about the heavy-handed and seemingly haphazard redactions that shielded Epstein’s associates from scrutiny. Others have expressed anger over under-redacted materials that exposed victims’ information.

After the department’s revelation Wednesday, Democratic Rep. Ro Khanna – who, alongside GOP Rep. Thomas Massie, had pushed for the bipartisan bill that compelled the Justice Department to make public the Epstein files – said that the two of them would “continue to keep the pressure on.”

“After we said we are bringing contempt, the DOJ is now finding millions more documents to release,” the California Democrat posted on X, adding, “The Epstein class must go.”

Massie, meanwhile, re-posted a video of Attorney General Pam Bondi telling reporters that when she appeared to claim in February an Epstein client list was sitting on her desk, she was actually just referring to an Epstein file.

“So what you’re saying is the files were never on @AGPamBondi’s desk like she claimed in this video?” Massie wrote.

Rep. Robert Garcia, the highest ranking Democrat on the House Oversight Committee, said in a statement, “It’s outrageous that Trump’s DOJ has illegally withheld over 1 million documents from the public,” adding that his committee wanted to hear from whistleblowers or “anyone at the DOJ who can assist us in bringing justice for the survivors.”

Frustration has also been mounting inside the White House about the handling of the files, with the drip-drip-drip nature of the releases prolonging a story Trump has long been loathe to discuss and the administration’s own message shifting dramatically in recent days.

The newly released documents revealed that federal prosecutors collected evidence in 2020 that Trump flew on Epstein’s private plane multiple times in the 1990s, and that the Justice Department subpoenaed Trump’s Mar-a-Lago club before the trial of Epstein associate Ghislaine Maxwell in 2021.

Also in the documents was a letter purportedly signed by “J. Epstein” to convicted sex offender Larry Nasser, containing what appeared to be a lewd reference to Trump. But the Justice Department said Tuesday that the letter was fake in-part because it didn’t appear to match Epstein’s handwriting. On Wednesday, the department testily responded on X to a journalist who questioned why officials would include a dubious document in its release.

“Because the law requires us to release all documents related to Jeffrey Epstein in our possession so that’s what we are doing, you dope. Are you suggesting we break the law?” the department’s official X account said.

Trump has never been accused by any law enforcement agency of involvement in any of Epstein’s crimes. He denies wrongdoing.

Other documents released last week contained never-before-seen pictures of former President Bill Clinton with Epstein, swimming in a pool with Maxwell, and sitting in a hot tub with a woman whose face was redacted.

Clinton also has never been accused by authorities of any involvement in Epstein’s crimes. In response to the disclosures, Clinton spokesman Angel Ureña said: “There are two types of people here. The first group knew nothing and cut Epstein off before his crimes came to light. The second group continued relationships with him after. We’re in the first.”

That more documents have come from the US Attorney’s Office in the Southern District of New York is not itself surprising. That is the office that investigated and charged Epstein in 2019 and followed that up with a successful sex-trafficking prosecution against Maxwell in 2021.

Clinton also has never been accused by authorities of any involvement in Epstein’s crimes. In response to the disclosures, Clinton spokesman Angel Ureña said: “There are two types of people here. The first group knew nothing and cut Epstein off before his crimes came to light. The second group continued relationships with him after. We’re in the first.”

That more documents have come from the US Attorney’s Office in the Southern District of New York is not itself surprising. That is the office that investigated and charged Epstein in 2019 and followed that up with a successful sex-trafficking prosecution against Maxwell in 2021.

https://www.cnn.com/2025/12/24/politics/epstein-documents-doj-million

I would believe a kid who told me his dog ate his homework before I would believe this BS.

...Everybody at this level of the sport talks about culture. How did KC's "great culture" carry them this season? The Eagles "culture" has been questioned all season. Winning fixes a lot. Losing creates problems. Culture doesn't grant immunity to age and injuries.

...all the teams that don't win the Superbowl could be the one right player away. Sadly, it has to be a particularly great player, and that often isn't available.

Joel Bitonio is on his last leg. Great guy and one of the few cultural builders but unfortunately he will not be with us after this or next season.
So we talk about 1 QB, 4 OL, at least 2 WR, 1 TE, probably a CB, probably a safety and some linesmen. Minimum 7, probably much more. Elite or close to elite.

It’s funny you talk about me and my culture.
Pat Mahomes and his friends in Kansas often talk about the same thing, so did Brad and so did the Eagles players after their win.

Winners talks about culture and mentality.
Losers are often only ONE player away…..