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I guess the scuttlebutt is Lebron basically had his people tell the Cavs he'd seriously consider a move back, but only if the cavs make another major move to bring another star in..ie Love, melo etc. I don't know why people think miami is the best option for james...they got exposed this year and it won't be any better. Cavs have a good nucleus and you add lebron to it its pretty impressive, plus the cavs have 3 first round picks next year..including funny enough the one we got for lebron. I truly believe It will either be Miami or CLE. I think he wants to stay in the east. Missing out on Lowry was a pretty big blow for Riley. Going to be an interesting FA. I hope we can package waiters and jack for something, if nothing else to clear cap . I'd rather not pick up Andy's option and give that money to Hawes. Andy is a square peg in a round hole with this offense..maybe they restructure or something not sure..But i want nothing to do with Andy at 9 million..
The problem with Andy is that he's not "Andy at $9 million" alone. He's either Andy at $9 million, or no Andy at $4 million. He has a $4 million guarantee for this coming year. That kind of changes things.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Then I take the 5 million left over and give it to someone who will play more than 50 games..
Or try to find a team that's trying to cut salary and is willing to give up somethng to do it..
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
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I wonder if Kevin Love is going to be the key to all of this. Remember, he's pretty much not going to sign with anybody unless he knows they're going to contend, and he said he'd sign with the Cavs if they had Lebron. The Timberwolves might be restricted with what they can get because of this. I'm not sure a team like Golden State pulls the trigger on trading someone like Klay Thompson unless they know Love will re-sign with them ... which I don't think he agreed to. Otherwise, that trade probably would of happened on Draft Day.
Would Minny go for a Love for TT & Dion trade now? It's seems like a really paltry offer for Minny, but maybe that's the best they can get now because of Love's reluctance to re-sign for the team taking him. (and the fact that the draft has passed). Lebron also wants to be on a contender. Maybe these two things become mutually inclusive now. Minny agrees in principle to trade Love to the Cavs because it's the best offer they can get ... & Lebron agrees to sign with the Cavs because they can show him that they can surround him with Irving, Wiggins, Love and Hawes. How could he say no to that? And how could Love not want to re-up? Again, it's going to come down to what Minny wants for Love.
I fear that the might just hang onto him until February though. Maybe they think they can get more for him around the trading deadline when some team desperate for deep playoff run needs a rental PF. But then again, what would they be able to give up for him?
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In addition to the 2 players you mention, I also read that we have 3 first round picks in 2015? Is that correct?
If so, maybe we trade a couple of young veterans along with a few 1st rounders to make a deal. I know that we won't be offering anything high if we were to get Lebron and Love ...... but that Heat oick might suddenly become a higher pick,
I still have this weird feeling that this is going to be a really interesting off-season.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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How about we just forget about James and build our own winner. Irving and Wiggins seems like a good start to me.
Just a side question...is Bennett so horrible he can't do anything? I don't really follow the Cavs to any degree. How can a guy taken #1 overall play like a guy who shouldn't have even been drafted...there has to be something that compelled us to draft him where we did.....no?
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
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Bennett is a great unknown right now. Between the shoulder injury, the asthma, and the poor shape he was in last year it was tough to see any positives. However, there are some really good reports on him this offseason (so far), about the shape that he's in and how hard he's working. I'll be curious to see how he does in Vegas.
[color:"green"] "World domination has encountered a momentary setback. Please talk amongst yourselves." Get Fuzzy[/color]
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I'm pretty ignorant about the NBA cap - how could the Cavs have Irving, James, and Love, and still have enough room to pay anyone else? Isn't the cap around $55M?
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I'm pretty ignorant about the NBA cap - how could the Cavs have Irving, James, and Love, and still have enough room to pay anyone else? Isn't the cap around $55M?
It's still a soft cap. We would have to sign James first, to bring us up to the cap, and then trade for Love, with close-to-matching salaries. Irving's contract doesn't kick in until next year, but the cap allows you to go over to "keep your own guys". Same thing with Love, we would have to re-sign him. But since he would already be on our roster, we could be over the cap when we do it. Next year we'd probably be well over the luxury cap, but with that team, who cares?
You can also still sign guys to mid-level exceptions and veteran minimums to flesh out the roster. We're still fairly lucky as most of our guys are still on rookie deals, that we could re-up after we've filled up our salary cap.
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I'm pretty ignorant about the NBA cap - how could the Cavs have Irving, James, and Love, and still have enough room to pay anyone else? Isn't the cap around $55M?
The cap is $63 million, IIRC.
As others noted, there are many ways around that. Brooklyn had a cap number somewhere around $114 million last year. The Heat were over $80 million this past year, and the cap was set at just under $60 million.
Basically, in the NBA, if you have an owner who is willing to spend, there are ways to let it happen. There is a luxury tax set as high as a $3.25/$1 for every dollar a team spends over a certain number. Brooklyn had to have had an enormous number in luxury tax.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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How about we just forget about James and build our own winner. Irving and Wiggins seems like a good start to me.
Just a side question...is Bennett so horrible he can't do anything? I don't really follow the Cavs to any degree. How can a guy taken #1 overall play like a guy who shouldn't have even been drafted...there has to be something that compelled us to draft him where we did.....no?
I would love to do that ..... but signing the best player on the planet definitely helps restart the franchise in a huge way. It's like the Browns trying to decide between signing Aaron Rodgers .... or drafting their own guy. Maybe it's even worse, because true superstars in the NBA are few and far between. In the NBA you try for the superstar if you have a shot at him, because it is so hard to find real superstars, especially outside of the very top of the draft.
As far as Bennett ..... he was off in almost every way imaginable last year. He seemed unprepared physically, mentally, health-wise and emotionally for the NBA. He started showing some of his talent for a few nights later in the season, but then got hurt again.Even before he got hurt, he was really inconsistent.
Now, this year he supposedly has been working hard at the Cavaliers facility, and is supposed to be in god shape and doing well. He is, at best, TBD. Hopefully the lights come on this year ...... but there are no guarantees. If he could come in and take that PF spot and make it his own, that would be great.He would seem to be a better fit with Irving and/or Waiters, because he can play away from the basket.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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J/C ......
I wonder how much of the Hayward talk was just to gauge whether or not Lebron had any interest in returning to Cleveland or not? That report came out, then all of a sudden Lebron's agent started making visits. If the Cavaliers signed Hayward, for example, that would close the door completely on Lebron returning. All of a sudden that talk ended, and the Lebron talk began.
I really think that Lebron is willing to move, but only to the right situation. I don't think that he wants to lose out on a great opportunity somewhere else, thus the tour of teams heading in to meet with his agent, and also why free agency seems to have come to a screeching halt. The "mid sized big guys" are going to have to see where the truly big guys wind up.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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and is supposed to be in god shape and doing well
In this type of shape, YTown  
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I don't know what my aversion to the 2nd O in gOOd is .....  I do that often, and I frequently miss the ' and hit the ; instead ..... like isn;t that weird? However, it would be nice to see Bennett come in in that kind of shape. He could smite all of our opponents before setting foot on the court. 
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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How about we just forget about James and build our own winner. Irving and Wiggins seems like a good start to me.
Sounds good to me.
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Just a side question...is Bennett so horrible he can't do anything? I don't really follow the Cavs to any degree. How can a guy taken #1 overall play like a guy who shouldn't have even been drafted...there has to be something that compelled us to draft him where we did.....no?
Bennett in his rookie year was so horrible he couldn't do anything. It is the off-season though so we get all the fluff stuff. Let's put it this way-- he has to drastically improve in many respects just to be a decent role player. Kind of underwhelming for a #1 overall pick.
There was no good reason to take him #1. Nobody had him going there. He was drafted there because the decision makers were complete, utter morons. It's easy to point the finger at Grant but he actually made a lot of great trades, and was supposedly a big fan of analytics. But PFs who come in at 6'7" in shoes don't grade out well in analytics. I've also read that Mike Brown (the guy who couldn't get it done with Lebron or Kobe) pushed hard for Bennett and it's possible that Gilbert intervened.
I think there was also a great deal of short-sightedness in the pick. The owner had already promised playoffs. The FO probably realized their mistake in drafting Thompson who kind of gimps the team because he's so limited on both ends of the court. He has no offensive game, but isn't big enough or strong enough to be a rim protecter. You almost need him playing with a guy like Hawes just to get some decent floor spacing, but I digress. I think drafting Bennett and passing on a guys like Noel and Oladipo was more about filling out the roster for last year, when the Cavs were never even close to being ready to compete. Contending for the 8th seed in the East isn't competing, but I seem to be in the minority opinion here on that one.
Long story short: The people who put this mess together are largely gone but due to the constant influx of #1 overall picks, the team is actually in great shape and has a promising future. Bonus points for accumulating a lot of assets over the last few years.
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If he starts honking like a swan, better button up.
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If he starts honking like a swan, better button up.
Wow ... obscure mythology post of the day.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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J/C ......
I wonder how much of the Hayward talk was just to gauge whether or not Lebron had any interest in returning to Cleveland or not? That report came out, then all of a sudden Lebron's agent started making visits. If the Cavaliers signed Hayward, for example, that would close the door completely on Lebron returning. All of a sudden that talk ended, and the Lebron talk began.
I really think that Lebron is willing to move, but only to the right situation. I don't think that he wants to lose out on a great opportunity somewhere else, thus the tour of teams heading in to meet with his agent, and also why free agency seems to have come to a screeching halt. The "mid sized big guys" are going to have to see where the truly big guys wind up.
thats my thought as well, regardless of reports Lebron is the Cavs #1 target..and if he isn't, i seriously question our FO. But the thing is, if you look at who has the available cap and core talent and flexibility, Cavs are easily the best option...If we were in a warm weather touristy state it wouldnt even be a hesitation. But what we can offer lebron is a All star PG, a innovative coach, hopefully a decent big, a crazy athletic 2 and a pretty decent bench, plus you throw in 3 more 1st round picks next year. Miami isn't even close to being able to do that. They aren't going to get younger..The vets all took less pay to ring chase, but that ran its course and now they are facing a complete retool and it will be harder to accumulate enough talent and assets to have any staying power. Atleast with Cleveland, we have one of the youngest teams in the NBA and I think there's alot of talent there but we just haven't had a competent coach. You give a guy like blatt Lebron, wiggins, irving, and hawes...the potential there is better than anything miami could do, then you sign and trade for Love or trade for love and then you have the flexibility to extend him and just worry about the luxury tax and Gilbert if nothing, has proven he'd pay for that..And could you imagine trying to get Cavs tickets with that lineup...damn. Ok I'll wake up from my dream now 
Tomorrow is the most important thing in life. Comes into us at midnight very clean. It's perfect when it arrives and it puts itself in our hands. It hopes we've learned something from yesterday. -John Wayne
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Not to mention that Lebron leaving Miami would help make that 1st from them even higher. lol
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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~ Legend
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those 1sts. We have two of them.
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I read an article the other day that said 3 ..... but I haven't checked for myself. OK,just checked, and according to realgm, we have our 1st rounder, and Miami's, which is protected 1-10. We also have a 1st from Memphis that is protected 1-5 and 15-30. (In other words, if the pick is 6-14, it's ours .... otherwise it's theirs. Chicago has the right to swap 1st rounders with us if they choose. I would guess that is only our original pick. I believe that it is highly unlikely that we get the Memphis pick this year ... but technically it appears that we do have 3. NBA Future Drafts Detailed - RealGM http://basketball.realgm.com/nba/draft/future_drafts/detailed
Last edited by YTownBrownsFan; 07/04/14 01:13 PM.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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But the thing is, if you look at who has the available cap and core talent and flexibility, Cavs are easily the best option
His goal is to win immediately. Outside of a blockbuster trade that infuses this team with some proven talent, we're not that team.
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But the thing is, if you look at who has the available cap and core talent and flexibility, Cavs are easily the best option
His goal is to win immediately. Outside of a blockbuster trade that infuses this team with some proven talent, we're not that team.
Agreed and it's not even close. Young teams don't win championships in the NBA.
That's not even getting into Cleveland as a destination or any hard feelings left from the fans or Gilbert's infamous "letter".
We are really pushing the whole off-season optimism thing to new limits these days.
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I agree on a few things, for example I don't think the Cavs have the talent to win a Championship, but if LBJ is here then I believe we have the talent to get to the finals.
Also someone posted on twitter the other night that Gilbert and LBJ have mended fences.
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But the thing is, if you look at who has the available cap and core talent and flexibility, Cavs are easily the best option
His goal is to win immediately. Outside of a blockbuster trade that infuses this team with some proven talent, we're not that team.
Thats why the key to this whole scenario is grabbing a love like player. So you had lebron to any team and they are immediate contenders...i mean he took a cavs team with larry hughes, ira newble, pavlovic and mo williams to the finals...lol, and he's even more well rounded now. So if you compare miami
irving >wade
Love>bosh
Lebron>rest of nba..lol
Lebron comes here with love and they both sign long term, you will have vets lining up to come here for the MLE and young guys like morrow will come here as well. Plus this would be a lot younger team and more chances to win multiple titles.. I think he knows miami is done in that regards. I know its a stretch this even happens..but it would def. be the most exciting thing in cleveland. Johnny football and lebron in the same city..it would be nuts if we had 2 out of three of our teams playing well. I have no hope for the tribe until they learn to play defense and put swisher out to pasture and bring up some of the young guys...the guys we have aren't getting it done.
Tomorrow is the most important thing in life. Comes into us at midnight very clean. It's perfect when it arrives and it puts itself in our hands. It hopes we've learned something from yesterday. -John Wayne
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We are really pushing the whole off-season optimism thing to new limits these days.
Yeah, it's something else right now.
We have a chance to land him, but if he's looking for a ring next year, Cleveland is not the place you want to be. I'd list the chances as doubtful, without some major moves being made.
Now, if you're looking long-term, we have some serious potential. I wouldn't be shocked to see him sign a short term deal, and if that happens, on paper we have great odds to be major players when the next circus rolls around.
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I agree on a few things, for example I don't think the Cavs have the talent to win a Championship, but if LBJ is here then I believe we have the talent to get to the finals.
Also someone posted on twitter the other night that Gilbert and LBJ have mended fences.
It came out last year that lebron sent feelers out to gilbert and they basically agreed they both handled it poorly and agreed to move on. But the other funny tidbit I think people forget, Someone interviewed Andy down in Brazil and asked if he tried to recruit lebron back and andy said lebron told he we will talk about that later. It's no secret that lebron is close to irving and thompson as well as andy..so its not like he wouldn't have a comfort level there
Tomorrow is the most important thing in life. Comes into us at midnight very clean. It's perfect when it arrives and it puts itself in our hands. It hopes we've learned something from yesterday. -John Wayne
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But the other funny tidbit I think people forget, Someone interviewed Andy down in Brazil and asked if he tried to recruit lebron back and andy said lebron told he we will talk about that later.
I did forget about that.
I take back what I said, he's obviously coming back to Cleveland.
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Also someone posted on twitter the other night that Gilbert and LBJ have mended fences.
This is the first I've heard of that, was this from a credible source?
President - Fort Collins Browns Backers
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But the other funny tidbit I think people forget, Someone interviewed Andy down in Brazil and asked if he tried to recruit lebron back and andy said lebron told he we will talk about that later.
I did forget about that.
I take back what I said, he's obviously coming back to Cleveland.
I'm not sure if you are being facetious, but I've always thought he would return, at least for the past year or so. I didn't think we would be seriously talking about it now, I assumed it would be in the next 1-3 years.
President - Fort Collins Browns Backers
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Yeah, I was being sarcastic.
I've always thought he'd come back here for his last contract.
I don't see him coming back this year. Not impossible, but not likely.
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Ok, I'll call that credible, thanks.
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I've always thought he'd come back here for his last contract.
I don't see him coming back this year. Not impossible, but not likely.
One thing I will be critical over, if he does come back and he does not have at least 1-2 years of his "prime game" left, it's like he's having his cake and eating it too. I think the window on a truly meaningful return to Cleveland is 2 years, 3 years max.
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Like I said, I wouldn't be shocked to see his next contract give him the flexibility to opt out after 1-3 years.
And I don't see such a short window for his relevancy on the court. I'm not saying you're wrong, but he can certainly be playing meaningful basketball into his mid-30's.
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How many years of his "prime" would you say he has left?
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In terms of being the best basketball player on the planet? 3-4 years is probably realistic, barring injury.
In terms of being a key contributor on a championship competitor? I think he can still be effective into his mid-late 30's.
He's done well for himself in terms of developing his game over his career. The leaps and bounds he's made in his shooting skillset has tacked some extra meaningful years onto his legacy.
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We have a chance to land him, but if he's looking for a ring next year, Cleveland is not the place you want to be. I'd list the chances as doubtful, without some major moves being made.
Like I said, I think a Kevin Love trade is key here. We make that, and we can offer him an Irving-Love combo, which would rival that of Wade-Bosh. Plus a freshly drafted Wiggins, could play the role of Kobe Bryant on those early Laker Juggernaut teams. That's a pretty decent starting three to pair with Lebron.
Why would Minnesota make that trade? Well they might not get anything better at this rate. We could offer Dion, TT, and multiple firsts. Dion has shown he can put up some pretty decent lines when he's not paired with Irving. TT can give you a near double-double every night and both are under 24. That Miami pick might wind up being better than our pick come the next few years and we also have Memphis's first with some lotto stipulations.
Minny isn't going to be able to get much for Love. He's refusing to sign an extension for just about any team outside of the Spurs. Nobody is going to be willing to give up much if that's the case, except for maybe a playoff team. What is a playoff team going to be able to give Minnesota? A late first? An overpaid bench bum? It's doubtful they'd want to deal a key piece of a playoff team for a couple month rental.
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Hall of Famer
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I have the feeling a Kevin Love deal does not get done without Wiggins being involved. The timberwolves are lucky to know they need to move him, but I think they sit on him for a kings ransom.
President - Fort Collins Browns Backers
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Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 11,465 |
Yeah, they may not end up getting a king's ransom for him, but I don't see a scenario where they shed him this early for freaking TT & Waiters.
Maybe down the line when they're desperate, but I'd still be looking to get more than that.
Plus, I'd expect Love to be more flexible once FA shakes out.
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Joined: Sep 2006
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Hall of Famer
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Quote:
Yeah, they may not end up getting a king's ransom for him, but I don't see a scenario where they shed him this early for freaking TT & Waiters.
Maybe down the line when they're desperate, but I'd still be looking to get more than that.
Plus, I'd expect Love to be more flexible once FA shakes out.
Who knows, maybeBron is colluding to bring Love here, the same as he did with DWade and The Velocoraptor. I think Brons people know that in order to do anything we need Bron to sign on the dotted line firxt because everythig revolves around that.
KING
You may be in the drivers seat but God is holding the map. #GMSTRONG
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DawgTalkers.net
Forums DawgTalk Tailgate Forum So, where will LeBron end up
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