I just love it when the Ravens shoot themselves in the foot...this time, it wasn't one of their players...it was their head coach.
Harbaugh: Pats' titles have asterisks
May 2, 2012, 7:10 AM ET
Baltimore Ravens coach John Harbaugh said Tuesday morning he thought the New England Patriots' three championships won under Bill Belichick "got asterisks now" and have been "stained" by the Spygate scandal that rocked the team in 2007.
Harbaugh made the comments in an interview on a Baltimore radio station. He was asked about the New Orleans Saints' recent bounty scandal and whether it was worth bending the rules if he thought he could get away with it, and Harbaugh brought up the Patriots' videotaping controversy in his response.
"In the end, everything is brought before the light of day, when it's all said and done," Harbaugh said on "98 Rock" in Baltimore. "What happens, even the thing in New England, no matter whether those things had any impact on whether they won their championships or not, they got asterisks now. It's been stained.
"To me, it's never worth it. You have to figure out ways to use the rules to your advantage; you have to figure out ways to make the most of everything. We have new work rules here as far as what we can do and what we can't do with our players, and we're going to make the most of it. What we're finding is, 'Man, maybe we can do some things even better than we did before, because these rules make us focus more on some things that we didn't focus on before.' You just have to make them work for you. That's what success is in the world. You have to find a way to do things better than somebody else. But if you're cheating, in the end, you're going to get discredited. It's not worth it."
Harbaugh clarified his comments in a statement released by the Ravens on Tuesday afternoon.
"While on the 98 Rock show this morning to talk about the run to honor O.J. Brigance and raise funds for ALS research, I answered a question about playing within the rules and referred to the perception that the Super Bowl championships won by the Patriots and Saints have a stain. My reference was to the perception out there that came as the result of the league's actions," Harbaugh said in the statement.
"I could have been more clear that I was referring to those viewpoints. I totally believe that the Patriot and Saint coaches and players earned those championships. Bill [Belichick] and Sean [Payton] both know that."
On Sept. 9, 2007, a Patriots cameraman was caught illegally videotaping the New York Jets' sideline during a game at Giants Stadium. It mushroomed into a controversy that hovered over the Patriots during their historic 16-0 season in 2007. Ultimately, the league handed down severe sanctions, with Belichick receiving a $500,000 fine. The Patriots were fined $250,000 and were stripped of a first-round draft pick.
ESPN analyst Tedy Bruschi, who was a linebacker on all three of the Patriots' title teams in the early 2000s and was with the Patriots in 2007 when the Spygate scandal broke, said he was perplexed by Harbaugh's comments.
"You want to take a shot, go ahead and say it," Bruschi said on Tuesday's "SportsCenter." "When I look down at my hand and I see championship rings, I know how much work had to be put in to win those championships. I'm very set and secure with all of the victories that we had, the work we put in."
Bruschi also reminded Harbaugh that, in some ways, he has Belichick to thank for landing the head coaching job with the Ravens in 2007. According to reports, the Ravens did not have Harbaugh on their coaching radar until Belichick called the team and recommended they talk to Harbaugh, who was then a Philadelphia Eagles assistant.
"The shot at Coach Belichick I don't understand," Bruschi said. "When Coach Harbaugh was interviewing for the job in Baltimore, it was Coach Belichick that vouched for him. There's a little bit of loyalty that Coach Harbaugh needs to learn."
Harbaugh said in the statement released by the Ravens that he called Belichick and Bruschi on Tuesday after his comments started to make headlines.
"I have so much respect for Coach Belichick and the job he does and has accomplished in his Hall of Fame career," he said. "I called him to remind him of my respect for him. I also reached out to Tedy Bruschi, who rightfully defended those Patriot players and coaches on ESPN, to tell him that I agree with him that the Patriots earned every victory."
Until his Tuesday radio interview, Harbaugh has had nothing but respectful things to say about Belichick and the Patriots. He even came to the defense of the team earlier this year after his kicking consultant insinuated the Patriots might have been involved in a scoreboard malfunction that may or may not have contributed to the Ravens losing the 2011 AFC Championship Game at Gillette Stadium.
Ravens kicker Billy Cundiff said he was rushed before hooking a 32-yard field goal, which would have tied the game with 11 seconds left in regulation, because he thought it was third down by looking at the scoreboard. It was actually fourth down. "I don't think you can rule anything out in New England, can you?" the consultant, Randy Brown, said.
Soon after, Harbaugh squashed what could have been a blossoming controversy.
"We knew what the down and distance were on our last series," Harbaugh said. "The scoreboard was not a factor for us. Any suggestion the wrong down information was a deliberate effort to affect the outcome of the game is nonsense."
The Patriots face the Ravens in Baltimore in Week 3 of the upcoming NFL season.
Then Harbaugh slammed that Ravens bus in reverse, as fast as he could...
John Harbaugh: Patriots earned those championships
May 1, 2012, 1:30 PM EDT
After saying in a radio interview that Spygate had “stained” the Patriots’ championships, Ravens coach John Harbaugh has now revised and extended those remarks.
Harbaugh issued a statement this afternoon after making those comments this morning, and he said in his statement that he wasn’t saying he personally believes the Patriots’ titles are tainted. He was saying he thinks others perceive the Patriots’ titles as tainted.
“I answered a question about playing within the rules and referred to the perception that the Super Bowl championships won by the Patriots and Saints have a stain,” Harbaugh said. “My reference was to the perception out there that came as the result of the league’s actions.”
The question asked to Harbaugh was about the Saints’ bounty scandal, and in answering Harbaugh largely ignored bounties and instead brought up Spygate. But in his clarification Harbaugh said he doesn’t want the coaches of either the Saints or the Patriots to think he was suggesting they didn’t earn their Super Bowl rings.
“I could have been more clear that I was referring to those viewpoints,” Harbaugh said. “I totally believe that the Patriot and Saint coaches and players earned those championships. Bill [Belichick] and Sean [Payton] both know that.”
Harbaugh said he has always liked and admired Belichick and contacted him today to say so.
“I called him to remind him of my respect for him,” Harbaugh said. “I also reached out to Tedy Bruschi, who rightfully defended those Patriot players and coaches on ESPN, to tell him that I agree with him that the Patriots earned every victory.”
The Ravens host the Patriots in Week Three on Sunday Night Football. Harbaugh may want to take some advice from his brother and prepare in advance for his post-game handshake.
Eric Mangini regrets turning in the Patriots over Spygate
May 1, 2012, 4:44 PM EDT
Eric Mangini, who as a Patriots assistant knew about the practice of taping opposing teams’ signals, and who informed the league office of the practice when he was the Jets’ head coach, said today that he regrets the way Spygate has continued to overshadow the Patriots and coach Bill Belichick.
After Ravens coach John Harbaugh called the Patriots’ titles tainted today, then said he regretted that comment, Mangini weighed in on ESPN’s NFL Live and said he regrets everything about Spygate. Mangini said that if he had it to do all over again, he never would have informed NFL Security that the Patriots were taping the Jets’ signals during a game on September 10, 2007.
“If there is a decision I could take back it’s easily that decision,” Mangini said. “Never in a million years would I have wanted it to go this way. It’s disappointing whenever it comes up.”
Mangini, who was an assistant on the Patriots’ three Super Bowl-winning teams, says he has never believed any of the Patriots’ titles were tainted, and he’s surprised that anyone would suggest they are.
“It’s regret, it’s disappointment, it’s all of those things,” Mangini said of the way he views Spygate now. “Because I know what it took to win those Super Bowls and I have so much respect for the people that were involved there. I’m disappointed that this is what it’s translated into.”
One reason for Mangini’s disappointment may be that he’s now viewed in coaching circles as an assistant whom a head coach would have trouble trusting. If Mangini wants to get back on an NFL staff, he’d need that head coach to believe he’d be more loyal than he was to Belichick. But Mangini said today that he wasn’t trying to hurt Belichick. All he really wanted was to beat the Patriots that day and keep them from getting any kind of an advantage.
“Never in a million years did I expect it to play out like this,” Mangini said. “This is one of those situations where I didn’t want them to do the things they were doing. I didn’t think it was any kind of significant advantage, but I wasn’t going to give them the convenience of doing it in our stadium, and I wanted to shut it down. But there was no intent to get the league involved. There was no intent to have the landslide that it has become.”
Mangini was seated alongside former Patriot Tedy Bruschi, who criticized Harbaugh today after Harbaugh made his comments about the Patriots’ “stained” titles. Bruschi said he traded voicemails with Harbaugh and has no hard feelings, and Mangini said he feels badly for his own role in forcing Bruschi into conversations like this one.
“To have guys like Tedy have to defend the championships that we earned in New England, and to have anything taken away from the Kraft family, from coach Belichick, and the players and coaches that have meant so much to me, never in a million years did I think it was going to translate into what it was going to translate into,” Mangini said. “And it doesn’t tarnish what we achieved there. It doesn’t tarnish what they achieved after the fact. I think when you look at the history of success that they had after that incident, it’s pretty obvious that it didn’t play any type of significant role in the victories we had or the success that we had.”
Some members of that 2007 Patriots team may have some ill will toward Mangini, but Bruschi doesn’t. And Mangini said he feels badly that he put Bruschi in a bad position by turning in the Patriots almost five years ago.
“That’s what’s so disappointing to me,” Mangini said. “The fact that Tedy has to sit here and talk about that because of a decision that I made, it’s disappointing.”
I get it, he's basically saying that because of the way both teams were caught breaking the rules that there is the possibility that some would feel there is a stigma attached to those championships... And in a way, there is.
These teams used tactics that weren't within the rule of the game and certainly weren't ethical
As to whether or not those tactics helped them win those games,,, who knows.. but the thought they may have is forever etched in history... thus the asterik he mentions..
Its kinda like the Pittsburgh SB win over the Seahawks.. Pretty much recognized as the game that was so poorly officiated that the Hawks didn't stand a chance.. That game should also have an asterik as far as I'm concerned...
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.” Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe." Damanshot
What no one wants to say is that Harbaugh is right, those titles are tainted. The Pats cheated. Maybe it helped them, maybe it didn't. That's beside the point. They were cheating, and they have no one to blame but themselves for being in the position of having to defend themselves. Its not Mangini's fault, or the press's fault. It's the Patriots' fault.
I always found it funny that people blame Mangini a ton for Spygate and say that there's no way that anyone can trust him.
Bill knew that Mangini was well aware of his taping activities. There was plenty out there that he told Bill he didn't care just don't tape the Jets (at the time). They decided to tape the Jets anyway.
Never screw over a guy that knows where the bodies are buried.
I agree. It's odd how the guy who caught the wrongdoers came out of that looking worse the wrongdoers themselves. Whether or not it gave them an advantage, they were doing something they should not have been. And the guy who is potentially getting the short end of the cheating is a d-bag because he came out against it.
I guess the police are worse citizens than the criminals they catch.
Quote: I guess the police are worse citizens than the criminals they catch.
I won't go that far as Mangini was apart of the Spygate scandal himself.
It's more like Bernie Madoff had a partner who helped him bilk millionaires before parting ways. He told him he didn't care if he kept doing it but to keep away from his new clients. Then, Madoff goes after his new clients and the partner catches him and turns him in.
Quote: What no one wants to say is that Harbaugh is right, those titles are tainted.
See, I think there are a lot of people that want to say Harbaugh is right. Most fans I know in my personal life, here or on other message abords haven't forgotten what the Pats did. I would argue it's a bigger "stain" than what the Saints did (bountygate - not the wire-tapping thing, it's yet to be confirmed).
“...Iguodala to Curry, back to Iguodala, up for the layup! Oh! Blocked by James! LeBron James with the rejection!”
Quote: What no one wants to say is that Harbaugh is right, those titles are tainted.
See, I think there are a lot of people that want to say Harbaugh is right. Most fans I know in my personal life, here or on other message abords haven't forgotten what the Pats did. I would argue it's a bigger "stain" than what the Saints did (bountygate - not the wire-tapping thing, it's yet to be confirmed).
The wire tapping thing is not what's bothering me,, I don't know if it's true. They other two things have apparently been proven enough to punish those involved.
They Broke the rules.. don't know if it helped them win the championships,, but if I could prove it did, I''d really and truly want those trophies back and the record books to reflect that there was not a championship winner those year and why.
Won't happen of course. But if you could prove it,, I'd pull the championships away from them......
As an aside, someone, Not you Punch, mentioned that Mangini may not have participated or known about Spygate.. I think he knew,, I think he had to and probably participated in it while with the Pats. for that matter, it woudln'lt surprise me at all to find that Romeo did as well..
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.” Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe." Damanshot
Quote: What no one wants to say is that Harbaugh is right, those titles are tainted.
See, I think there are a lot of people that want to say Harbaugh is right. Most fans I know in my personal life, here or on other message abords haven't forgotten what the Pats did. I would argue it's a bigger "stain" than what the Saints did (bountygate - not the wire-tapping thing, it's yet to be confirmed).
I'm in total agreement. Only in the eyes of BSPN and the whiny patriots is what Harbaugh said offensive or inappropriate. They cheated and got caught. Man up and take the medicine....all of it, including the asterisks. I applaud Harbaugh for saying what others don't have the balls to.
And into the forest I go, to lose my mind and find my soul. - John Muir
Quote: What no one wants to say is that Harbaugh is right, those titles are tainted.
See, I think there are a lot of people that want to say Harbaugh is right. Most fans I know in my personal life, here or on other message abords haven't forgotten what the Pats did. I would argue it's a bigger "stain" than what the Saints did (bountygate - not the wire-tapping thing, it's yet to be confirmed).
I'm in total agreement. Only in the eyes of BSPN and the whiny patriots is what Harbaugh said offensive or inappropriate. They cheated and got caught. Man up and take the medicine....all of it, including the asterisks. I applaud Harbaugh for saying what others don't have the balls to.
I agree. Although.. it is weird agreeing with the HMFIC of the Ravens. Also, notice how fast he backtracked...from "they were tainted" to "I believe they deserved their championships..."
wire-tapping thing? I'm saddened by the bounty/Saints scandal, b/c I was cheering for the Saints all the way. They deserved that win! Although people have said the '09 NFC title game was the real super bowl.
Exactly, everybody is thinking the same thing. The Pats won because they cheated. Hell, they even made a South Park episode where Cartman flat out said the Pats couldn't win without cheating. The question is, if Brady is all that, if BB is such a brilliant coach, then why haven't the Pats won it all since they were caught? There's a rule of life, it isn't cheating until you get caught. I've heard it a million times from my friends, family and coaches. It kind of falls in line with the you can bull$#it your way through anything bit. We're taught since kids not to be tattle tales or rats, and even if you're doing the right thing and you're a rat you're worse than the person that committed the crime. The mentality lasts all our lives.
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