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Quote:
We got zero in return.
Eve,
I understand that you thought we should keep these guys and you backed up your point...although I completely disagree.
But...we got waaaaaaaay more than "zero" in return.
2nd Rd Pick 2009
5th Rd Pick 2010
3rd Rd Pick 2010 (could have been a 2nd if BE could catch the ball)
5th Rd Pick 2010
Serviceable LB who started at ILB and OLB and will likely stick in the NFL
Serviceable WR who will likely stick in the NFL
Avoided the toxic contract that Winslow got from Tampa - HUGE cap savings
Avoided the toxic future contract demand and ever-present toxicity of BE in general
I would do that trade again tomorrow...and the next day...and the next...well...you know.
Oh yeah...maybe...just maybe...the coaches and front office concluded (on their own) that those guys had to go and what we got in return was a steal.
Or...
It was the fans that ran those two malcontents out of town. Doubt that though.
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...just clicking...
Those of you who are thinking and replying with your heart and not your brain need to answer the questions below...then debate the "issues"..
Back to the basics of the debate...
...Rogers is not happy...WHY?
........Rogers was happy when he played for Crennel, but he and Mangini got off on the wrong foot from the first day they were in the same room together and didn't speak to each other...for that, I blame Mangini.
........#1 reason Rogers is not happy, Mangini..
..............now we know, Mangini is staying...that is not going to make Rogers happy..
What can Holmgren do to make Rogers happy with Mangini?
.........#2 reason Rogers is not happy...MONEY..
..............Rogers signed a 6 yr, $42 million contract in March 2008
..............Feb 2009, Albert Haynesworth signed a 7 yr, $100+ contract with the Redskins. Rogers wants a Haynesworth type contract
What can Holmgren do to make Rogers happy with his contract?
Should Holmgren give Rogers a Haynesworth type contract?
OR...should Holmgren work out a trade for Rogers, knowing he can't do what Rogers wants...knowing that the Browns can't "make" Rogers happy?
Last edited by mac; 01/21/10 09:45 AM.
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Did I miss something?
Where is it being reported that Rodgers is unhappy and wants out?
Trust me thats not because I know nothing..it's because I haven't read that anywhere.
Are U not mistaken this for Corey Williams??
Last edited by Attack Dawg; 01/21/10 09:52 AM.
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You run the laps because YOUR boss told you to.
If you are a team leader, than you lead by example.
I understand that Rogers was a pro bowler, but this I promise you, he does not know more about defensive scheming and execution than Mangini.
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Everyone in this thread is overvaluing shaun rogers. We got him for a 3rd and Bodden. His value has only decreased because of the injuries, his insane contract, and his age. Remeber when we signed Rogers, he was on the last yr of his deal. Now he is in the middle of a 6 year deal worth over $36 million. He can't play everydown, and has come off a season where he finished on IR. Teams are not lining up to give us their future franchise QB, 1st rd picks, etc... for a 31 yr old injury prone, 2 down defensive tackle. Guys get real, use your head, not your browns fandom when evaluating this scenario. Kolb is untouchable in Philly. Thats the way it is, McNabb is in the last year of his contract, injury prone, and Kolb is their guy of the future.
"The medium for the bad news was ESPN, which figured. The network represents much of what is loud, obnoxious and empty in sports today."
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So people aren't thinking with their brains, but your brain knows that Rogers isn't happy? 
As you always say to other posters: Prove it. Got links? Articles?
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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Quote:
Did I miss something?
Where is it being reported that Rodgers is unhappy and wants out?
Trust me thats not because I know nothing..it's because I haven't read that anywhere.
Are U not mistaken this for Corey Williams??
Tacker n Toad...got a search feature on your puter?
Try typing in "Shaun Rogers not happy in Cleveland"
Then read...
I will even give you the link to the very first story that comes up on the search page... web page
The title of this article. "Browns tackle Shaun Rogers reportedly wants off team, upset with new coach Eric Mangini"
The two issues I listed and the two issues highlighted in this story "still" have not been resolved...Mangini is still coaching and no talk of a new contract for Rogers.
But hopefully everyone who thinks Rogers is a happy camper will keep reading...and before you say, that's just old stuff...the issues remain.
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But, do you have anything recent?
Using your search criteria, I found nothing.
#gmstrong #gmlapdance
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I'm not even going to the link..that stuff was before the season and nothing was heard about Shaun saying anything later about wanting out..even when Carp Mouth Smith spouted he should come to D-Town Shaun rebutted it..which wasn't hard..
U got a search for something new?
No..
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I think if the price is right just about everyone on the team is available for trade. Rogers, Cribbs except maybe Thomas. I think this is the same with all teams. Maybe one or two players are untouchable but for the most part, if offered the right deal just about any player will be traded. It's just the nature of the business.
Edwards- I am happy with this trade.
Winslow- May be a good trade. But, I like Winslow and wish he where still the team. Although I fully understand why we traded him.
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Quote:
But, do you have anything recent?
Using your search criteria, I found nothing.
Quote:
I'm not even going to the link..that stuff was before the season and nothing was heard about Shaun saying anything later about wanting out..even when Carp Mouth Smith spouted he should come to D-Town Shaun rebutted it..which wasn't hard..
U got a search for something new?
No..
Tack..Michelle...the very last words of my post read... "...and before you say, that's just old stuff...the issues remain."
THE ISSUES REMAIN...
You can hide from the truth...you can run away from the truth...you can bury your head in the sand and pretend all is happy in Shaun Rogers land...but that would not be the truth either!
Rogers is due a chunk of change (per contract), real soon...and the Browns defense played better after Rogers got hurt.
These are not points I made up...they are included in this Jan 17, 2010 article
web page
If Holmgren can figure out how to make Rogers happy, GREAT...
...BUT, Shaun Rogers playing below his potential because he doesn't want to be in Cleveland...will not help the Browns achieve their goals going into the 2010 season.
Now is the time for Holmgren, Heckert and Mangini to decide what to do with Rogers...even if some Browns fans don't want to think about it, read about it or talk about it..."it" is not going away until something is done to solve "it".
Last edited by mac; 01/21/10 11:58 AM.
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umm....I saw Shaun Rogers play this year....he sure seemed to have the same motor that he had last year. It did not look like he wasn't trying out there.
so, how would anyone know if the issues remain or not? they could...maybe he's not happy..but since his play did not go down, how can you be sure?
and, the defense played better in part because of the opponents we faced....and there has been some debate on whether Rogers propensity to give up his lane in order to gain penetration in the backfield might actually hurt our defense. but, i have not seen anything 'on the field' that would indicate he is unhappy.
#gmstrong
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Ain't nuthing to hide...dude is probably playing out of position..it ain't rocket science..if he can't be moved out of here,then he just needs to be at DE...it really is that simple.
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Shaun Rogers a 2 down lineman? Since when? 
"All I know is, as long as I led the Southeastern Conference in scoring, my grades would be fine." - Charles Barkley
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Tacker... New contract, to make Rogers happy?
Is Rogers worth Haynesworth type money?
The issues have not changed...here is good read to sum it up..
web page
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Why do U need to have this addressed when it's not a issue now?
They also have time to determine what they want to do with Rodgers..there are two options..trade him,keep him..redoing a contract is not a factor IMO..
There are bigger fish to fry..
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Quote:
The issues have not changed...here is good read to sum it up..
Sorry mac, until I see something more recent.. I'll go under the assumption that Rogers will be here next year and that he will be playing hard... Surely he has to know that he is over 30 and coming off a bad injury, he ain't getting $100million from anybody.
yebat' Putin
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There hasn't been anything out there lately to suggest that Rogers is unhappy. No news is good news, I say.
I see what people are saying regarding the defense's play once Rogers was out, but I don't buy it. There are too many different variables to come to a conclusion like that.
Really, what it comes down to is that Rogers is a beast out there on the field. The motivation argument is an old and stale argument that has followed him from his Detroit days and, in my opinion, is a non-issue. Until we see something new in the paper, I don't buy it.
The real question is how we use Rogers. Personally, I would love to see him at end doing what he loves to do. He's also shown he can be effective at nose. The way I see it, it's a win-win (unless we ship him out).
There is no level of sucking we haven't seen; in fact, I'm pretty sure we hold the patents on a few levels of sucking NOBODY had seen until the past few years.
-PrplPplEater
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This needs to be dealt with fast. I don't know how the Browns could have let it get so bad ... Quote:
"Dennis Northcutt will never play for the Cleveland Browns again, under any circumstances," Stanley said on Wednesday, frustrated that he was unable to broker a deal after talking with Policy and Newsome over the course of two days this week.
"If they trade him to any team other than Baltimore, he will not report."
Stanley also accused the Browns of negotiating in "bad faith," while Policy charges that Stanley is at fault for allowing his client to face such a predicament.
web page
Nothing has changed. Something needs to be done about this.!!!!!
#gmstrong
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good one 
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Quote:
This needs to be dealt with fast. I don't know how the Browns could have let it get so bad ...
Quote:
"Dennis Northcutt will never play for the Cleveland Browns again, under any circumstances," Stanley said on Wednesday, frustrated that he was unable to broker a deal after talking with Policy and Newsome over the course of two days this week.
"If they trade him to any team other than Baltimore, he will not report."
Stanley also accused the Browns of negotiating in "bad faith," while Policy charges that Stanley is at fault for allowing his client to face such a predicament.
web page
Nothing has changed. Something needs to be done about this.!!!!!
ddub...You click on me, post a quote that didn't come from me...
... and was not part of any article I linked to...maybe you can tell me what Northcutt has to do with Rogers?
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Quote:
Quote:
This needs to be dealt with fast. I don't know how the Browns could have let it get so bad ...
Quote:
"Dennis Northcutt will never play for the Cleveland Browns again, under any circumstances," Stanley said on Wednesday, frustrated that he was unable to broker a deal after talking with Policy and Newsome over the course of two days this week.
"If they trade him to any team other than Baltimore, he will not report."
Stanley also accused the Browns of negotiating in "bad faith," while Policy charges that Stanley is at fault for allowing his client to face such a predicament.
web page
Nothing has changed. Something needs to be done about this.!!!!!
ddub...You click on me, post a quote that didn't come from me...
... and was not part of any article I linked to...maybe you can tell me what Northcutt has to do with Rogers?
Nothing. That's the point....
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
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Quote:
Nothing. That's the point....
Peen...nice try...you obviously don't understand it either..
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Quote:
Peen...nice try...you obviously don't understand it either..
No Mac, you don't understand. His point is your posting an article from last year is as silly as posting a Dennis Northcutt article! (Because the article is so dated. Northcutt is not on the team, therefore it makes no sense to post a northcutt article, it's pointless. Rogers was angry at Mangini a year ago for ignoring him at some function, but that was a year ago, it's pointless, not evidence for anything)
There is nothing that says Rogers is unhappy from this year. This is 2010! Only a Terry Pluto article that says we did better against the run without Rogers and maybe we should trade his while the value is high.
So STOP SAYING ROGERS IS UNHAPPY! You have no evidence other than an articles from LAST YEAR. I was angry at my boss last year when I didn't get a raise for the third year in a row, guess what, i got over it. The money wasn't there, I was going to work there no matter what, it was too convinient for me not to. And I'm not angry at him right now............ Feelings change, just because he was pissed at Mangini a year ago because Mangini ignored him doesn't mean he's pissed in the slightest bit about that now
People get over things Mac. At least over the course of a whole season. And a Terry Pluto article talking about how we may be should trade Rogers says nothing about discontent or that Mike Holmgren is even thinking about trading him.
Last edited by PeteyDangerous; 01/22/10 10:22 AM.
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Whether or not they decide to trade him, I'd still be all for it. The Steelers let Casey Hampton play out his contract, and now he is a FA and of no value to them. I mean, they COULD franchise him but thanks to Albert Haynesworth, that "average of top 5 players in the position" money is going to be awful expensive for a 1 year agreement.
All I am saying is if Rogers has a good trade value, we gotta look it (like anyone on our team), but ALSO, realize that even by NEXT year at this time, he is over the hill of 30, and wouldn't be worth as much as now. Some teams like to bank their future on one or two players, and if we could take someone to the cleaners on an athletic monster (someone call Al- Davis) I would pull the trigger on a 2nd rounder for him. Simply because we could still (possibly) get a top 3 NT or DT in the trenches near the top of the second round. Will he be amazing? Thats why we brought in Heckert ... but if nothing else, we can be building our D-Line for now AND the future...rather than a team who let thier D-Line get old (once again: look at the steelers, their top 4 D-Linemen are Keisel (31), Hampton (32), Kirschke (35), and Smith (33)) - I just hope we don't neglect our D-Line
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Quote:
Some teams like to bank their future on one or two players, and if we could take someone to the cleaners on an athletic monster (someone call Al- Davis) I would pull the trigger on a 2nd rounder for him. Simply because we could still (possibly) get a top 3 NT or DT in the trenches near the top of the second round.
I'd love to trade Rogers to the Raiders for a 2nd round pick. But I don't think that's happening. And there's a big difference between a high second and a low second in my book. I'd love to get a high second for Rogers.
But I don't see that happening. I don't think i'd want to get a late 2nd or 3rd or later for him
Just Wondering: When I say high 1st or high 2nd I mean early first or early 2nd. Do you guys say low 1st or low 2nd to mean early, or are you like me and flip it around?
Last edited by PeteyDangerous; 01/22/10 11:16 AM.
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so, rogers was unhappy 10 months ago....before mending his relationship with the coach, before playing a few games, and before going on IR.
i fail to understand the connection betwen goings-on last offseason to now. thats a biggger reach than heyward-bey at 7.
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Ahhhhhhhhhhhhh ; The off season for us Browns fans !
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Ahhhhhhhhhhhhh ; The off season for us Browns fans !
Hey, at least the offseason didn't start early this year like usual! Well it sort of did until we all of a sudden went on our 4 game winning streak.
That's the most fun I've had watching my guys since may be 2007, although as a package, those 4 games were more fun for me than any other 4 games in a row we've played since we returned. Plus we started the streak by beating the Steelers!
I like to think that my threads that I posted in the final two weeks saying "I think we're going to win this game" and "I think we're also going to win this game" had a major effect. Call me superstitious if you want, but in my book, that's just me doing my part 
Just so everyone knows, we can all blame the loss to Detroit on the dumb blonde bartender at the bar i went to who turned the tv off right when Matt Stafford was throwing his deep hail marry. I start screaming at her (at a cramped family establishment no less, I hope she felt embarassed), and when she finally gets the game on again Hank Poteat is standing there with his hands up wondering what he did wrong..... She came to watch with me when they went for two, like she was actually interested and felt sorry, but that didn't change the fact that she made the Browns lose. Dumb broad
Last edited by PeteyDangerous; 01/22/10 11:55 AM.
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Quote:
Quote:
Peen...nice try...you obviously don't understand it either..
No Mac, you don't understand. His point is your posting an article from last year is as silly as posting a Dennis Northcutt article! (Because the article is so dated. Northcutt is not on the team, therefore it makes no sense to post a northcutt article, it's pointless. Rogers was angry at Mangini a year ago for ignoring him at some function, but that was a year ago, it's pointless, not evidence for anything)
There is nothing that says Rogers is unhappy from this year. This is 2010! Only a Terry Pluto article that says we did better against the run without Rogers and maybe we should trade his while the value is high.
So STOP SAYING ROGERS IS UNHAPPY! You have no evidence other than an articles from LAST YEAR. I was angry at my boss last year when I didn't get a raise for the third year in a row, guess what, i got over it. The money wasn't there, I was going to work there no matter what, it was too convinient for me not to. And I'm not angry at him right now............ Feelings change, just because he was pissed at Mangini a year ago because Mangini ignored him doesn't mean he's pissed in the slightest bit about that now
People get over things Mac. At least over the course of a whole season. And a Terry Pluto article talking about how we may be should trade Rogers says nothing about discontent or that Mike Holmgren is even thinking about trading him.
Petey...after all the above, you post this..." I'd love to trade Rogers to the Raiders for a 2nd round pick"...
Which happens to be very similar to "my earlier post"...
"Rogers loved playing for Crennel and now Romeo is in KC. Maybe the Chiefs would be willing to work out a deal for Rogers. KC has the 4th pick in the 2nd round, which IMO, would be perfect, with maybe another player tossed in from the Chiefs."
Petey...IMO, Rogers wants out of Cleveland and it doesn't matter what you claim, it won't change my opinion. As one article pointed out, Heckert and Holmgren are doing player evaluations at this time. It was also pointed out that the Browns defense played better after Rogers was hurt...therefore, it does not take a rocket scientist to ask the question...is now the time to move Rogers?
..IMO, the answer is YES, trade Rogers.
Rogers was not happy with Mangini but may be happier than a lark now, according to some Rogers fans...it doesn't matter.
After Haynesworth got a $100+ million contract from the Redskins, Rogers felt he was worth more than the Browns contract was paying him.
Does Rogers still feel he's worth more than the Browns are paying him?...it doesn't matter.
The facts as laid out have not changed...the performance of the Browns defense did not suffer when Rogers went on IR and this might be the perfect time to trade Shaun Rogers.
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Petey...IMO, Rogers wants out of Cleveland and it doesn't matter what you claim, it won't change my opinion.
Nobody cares to change your opinion. It's your factual statement that Rogers is unhappy that has people correctly throwing the BS flag at your feet.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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Petey...IMO, Rogers wants out of Cleveland and it doesn't matter what you claim, it won't change my opinion. As one article pointed out, Heckert and Holmgren are doing player evaluations at this time. It was also pointed out that the Browns defense played better after Rogers was hurt...therefore, it does not take a rocket scientist to ask the question...is now the time to move Rogers?
But what evidence do you have to backup that opinion? I gave an answer to a hypothetical situation, if we are given an early 2nd round pick or earlier, I'm all for trading Shaun Rogers.
But you are just saying "Shaun Rogers isn't happy", where do you get this from? Everything you have to substantiate that was from before he even met Mangini, lol. That and that he dogged mistake laps early in training camp. He's 370 Pounds and I like him at 370 pounds. I don't want him jogging laps anyway, lol.
There are articles that say that guys had trouble getting on the page with Mangini (buying into the process) but now that they all are with it, team morale is up.
But yeah, you gotta have some sort of evidence to back up your opinion when you make statements like that. And real evidence, not articles from lastyear before Shaun Rogers even got to know EM.
Otherwise I can just say, "Mohammad Massaquoi hates Eric Mangini, and I think we should trade him before he comes a problem". I have nothing to back that up with, but that's how I feel, so I'm gonna say it
Last edited by PeteyDangerous; 01/22/10 02:21 PM.
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Quote:
But what evidence do you have to backup that opinion?
he doesn't need evidence for him to have that opinion.. But he'll need more than him saying so to prove anything to anyone else... That is the only problem I see with mac insisting that Rogers wants out of Cleveland..
Mac.. if you are thinking that a year old article verifies your beliefs,, I can't agree with you.. But you are entitled to your opinion,,No matter how much I personally feel it's a big, huge, stinky pile of cow dung....
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Maybe if we give Rogers a part ownership in the team, he'll be happy!! 
There may be people who have more talent than you, but there's no excuse for anyone to work harder than you do.
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Legend
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Posts: 40,399 |
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the performance of the Browns defense did not suffer when Rogers went on IR
This may be true.. but what if Rubin goes on IR in week 3 next year? It sure would be nice to have Rogers at DE so he could rotate into the middle and help pick up the slack.... or do we have another Rubin on the team that can step in and do just as well or better?
I'm neither for nor against trading Rogers. He is aging and this team is building for 2-3 years from now when Rogers will be well past his prime so if we can get good value for him NOW.. then I'm not opposed to that at all...
It has nothing to do with his "happiness" for me at all.. it's all about the business of building a better football team, not just next year but for the future.
yebat' Putin
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 7,189
Hall of Famer
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Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 7,189 |
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ddub...You click on me, post a quote that didn't come from me...
... and was not part of any article I linked to...maybe you can tell me what Northcutt has to do with Rogers?
Maybe you can tell me what Rogers being upset a year ago has to do with his current status regarding the team.
Sure, it was common knowledge that he was upset with Mangini a year ago. It was also common knowledge that the two of them ironed it all out and he was happy.
But you are reaching back into the past and bring forward links to articles from a year ago and maintaining that this is still an issue when in truth it stopped being an issue before training camp last year.
That's what it has to do with Northcutt. The Northcutt issue is long gone and forgotten as is the issue between Mangini and Rogers.
Why do you pound on it like it all happened yesterday?
And yes, there has been talk of whether or not to trade Rogers. That is because he has value and Rubin has done well at NT. Rogers is more suited to the 4-3 defense and he should get us a nice pick or two and we need all we can get.
But it has nothing to do with his being upset with Mangini like those year old articles you keep referencing.
#gmstrong
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 42,858
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 42,858 |
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Maybe if we give Rogers a part ownership in the team, he'll be happy!!
Just answer 1 question for me will ya,, now don't beat around the bush I want a simple answer.. Would the team be better off with Rogers as a part owner or wouldn't it.. Come on,, Answer the question
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 31
Rookie
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Rookie
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 31 |
He is a nice player! But I'd trade him now when you can get maybe a 2 & 3? Or whatever... do it now.. We are not going to be good in time for him to make a huge difference.
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,656
Dawg Talker
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Dawg Talker
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,656 |
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Just answer 1 question for me will ya,, now don't beat around the bush I want a simple answer.. Would the team be better off with Rogers as a part owner or wouldn't it.. Come on,, Answer the question
I just spit out my drink when I read that!!
There may be people who have more talent than you, but there's no excuse for anyone to work harder than you do.
-Derek Jeter
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Joined: Sep 2006
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Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,399 |
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He is a nice player! But I'd trade him now when you can get maybe a 2 & 3? Or whatever... do it now.. We are not going to be good in time for him to make a huge difference.
Exactly. I'm not willing to GIVE him away because he can help us next year but if the offer is decent to make us better down the road, take it.
yebat' Putin
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Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum On Trading Rogers
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