Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Page 2 of 2 1 2
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 11,465
P
PDR Offline
Legend
Offline
Legend
P
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 11,465
Quote:

Beleive what you want, but to say that he is not a communist, when everything he does leans that way is nonsense. Facist might be a better description. Arrogant jackahole is better IMO.




Communist is nonsense and incredibly misguided...

Fascist is actually a somewhat apt description.

Quote:

Comparing his love for the country with Bush's is a farce. Nice try though.




I didn't compare their respective 'love of country'...I compared them as presidents...where they're pretty close to the same.

Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 1,449
Likes: 1
Dawg Talker
Offline
Dawg Talker
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 1,449
Likes: 1
Quote:

I have avoided most of the political threads due to the assinine replies the left leaning posters use. But I find it funny that not one of the Obama supporters are even replying to this thread.
Peen is more right than I would like to believe. Our country has been taken over by the very party (communist) that our fathers and their fathers fought against. The youth in this country are ignorant to facts, TRUE facts, not ones proposed by college professors with the same agenda as the left politicians. They voted for this fool because they thought it was cool. The media made Bush the villian, and used their influence to skew facts and premote socialism and all it entails, all the while discrediting anybody who premoted the truth.

This administration is so anti- American it is painful to see. Many claimed Bush was power hungry and arrogant, the media was the vehicle which was used. Now we have the most arrogant, egotistical, self absorbed president in the history of this country. He lies constantly and the media turns their head.

All great civilizations have disappeared eventually, and many for the same reasons. Our country is being dismantled by communist, facists, and the lemmings in the congress that care more about their own power than the country or it's people.

When poll after poll prove that the people of this country are not in agreement with what the government, specifically the Democrats, are doing, yet the leaders of both the House and Senate turn their noses up at them, something needs to be done. Reid, Pelosi, and Obama could give a rat's behind what the people want. They are all about what they want.

I never would incite violence, but if it is what it would take to restore the Constitution and what it stands for, I would become as violent as needed. I believe there are many others across this nation who are at that point already. So all who want to come here and defend this jackahole Obama, remember you are part of the problem. And if it ever did come down to violence, I wouldn't want to be on the opposite side of true Americans. And if you think that what this administration and the Democratic leaders are doing to our country is American, then you are a fool and will pay the price for your blind worship of this travesty called Obama.





Amen brother!

Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,405
Likes: 460
Legend
Offline
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,405
Likes: 460
Ah Utiopia ......

Just thought that this was a wonderful little overlooked aspect of this bill ...... and one that could lead to employers discontinuing wellness coverage, company gyms, and the like .... even if they benefit some greatly.

http://www.cleveland.com/open/index.ssf/2010/01/health_reform_bill_could_penal.html

Health reform bill could penalize people who don't go to the gym, lose weight, stop smoking

WASHINGTON -- Going to a company-sponsored gym or smoking-cessation workshop makes for a healthy society, as every member of Congress seems to agree. But if your company or insurer offers a wellness program and you don't go, should you have to pay higher insurance rates than those who attend?

That's the crux of little-noticed dispute within Washington that has the nation's major health-care organizations up in arms. The Senate version of health care reform legislation, they say, has provisions that could penalize people not only for refusing to go to health screenings or exercise programs, but also those who attend but still keep smoking or don't bring down their blood pressure or body-mass index.

This could undo a key objective of health reform: to keep people from paying more for insurance based on health factors they may be unable to control.

"This is huge problem," said Karen Pollitz, a health policy professor at Georgetown University.

The goal of wellness programs is not the issue, both she and Dick Woodruff, senior director of federal affairs for the American Cancer Society's Cancer Action Network, say.

"We're all for workplace wellness, where you have time out to go to the gym or you have a gym on premises or you have healthy food in the workplace," Woodruff said. "That stuff is good. But when you take it to the next level and make it punitive, that's where it's wrong."

Potentially, people with genetic pre-dispositions toward weight gain, high blood pressure or diseases could be penalized for not meeting health-improvement goals, he and others from disease-prevention groups said. The bill would not require employers or insurers to charge the assessments, but health advocates and lobbyists say the practice would be inevitable.


The legislation would allow exceptions if a doctor said it was "unreasonably difficult" or "medically inadvisable" for a patient to satisfy a program's health standard. But employers or insurers then could require alternative measures or treatments or periodic screenings.

Patients' privacy would also be violated, some say. What was once between you and your doctor now would be between your doctor and your employer.

More than 110 organizations agree, including the nation's leading groups seeking research funding and cures for heart disease, Alzheimer's, epilepsy, cerebral palsy and diabetes. In a Dec. 21 letter to members of Congress, the groups urged lawmakers to use the coming discussions between Senate and House negotiators to "close the loophole."

Health-screening and wellness programs linked to insurance are not new. Federal regulations approved by President George W. Bush in 2006 allowed companies to charge individuals as much as 20 percent of the cost of insurance if they did not join their employers' wellness plans. Employees are generally told they have a chance to save on insurance costs while staying healthy.

Critics say the goal is fine, but not if it creates a backdoor way to shift costs to less-healthy people or those who lack time or transportation to get to the gym.

The Senate bill would allow penalties as high as 30 percent of the cost of insurance -- easily a $4,000 penalty for those in a family plan. But penalties could rise as high as 50 percent, or more than $6,600 under current insurance costs, if the secretaries of Health and Human Services, Labor and Treasury "determine that such an increase is appropriate," the Senate bill says.

The Senate bill also could extend penalties to the individual insurance market, which is expected to grow by millions. The legislation would establish pilot wellness programs -- and allow for non-participation penalties -- for the individual market in up to 10 states, Pollitz said.

That could wipe out any savings that low-income individuals would get through health-reform subsidies, Pollitz added. While they might only have to pay hundreds of dollars for their insurance, they could be assessed thousands of dollars through the wellness fines.

It is unclear how this will be resolved, since the House of Representatives health-care legislation, while promoting wellness, does not have the penalties. U.S. Rep. Vic Snyder, a doctor from Arkansas, said he considers prevention and wellness programs "very, very important," but it would be unfair to punish people who can't get results.

"I have known cardiac surgeons who cannot quit smoking," Snyder said. "It's an incredible addiction."

The issue, first noted by a Consumer Reports health blogger, has gained little attention, although a letter sent Wednesday from AARP to congressional leaders might change that. Addressing a number of health-reform issues, AARP CEO A. Barry Rand pointed out the Senate provisions and said, "Charging more based on health status is a practice that must end once and for all."

Sen. Sherrod Brown, an Ohio Democrat active in health legislation, is monitoring the issue, spokeswoman Meghan Dubyak said. She said the provision came from extensive negotiations in the Senate health committee, and "is aimed at encouraging more Americans to participate" in workplace wellness programs.

It "is not intended to create a loophole for medical underwriting, which Sen. Brown strongly opposes," she said. Brown "is working with his colleagues and communicating with House and Senate leadership to ensure that the final provision achieves its intended goals: lowering health costs by encouraging prevention and wellness


Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.

John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 28,157
Likes: 839
Legend
Offline
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 28,157
Likes: 839
So, I'm going to be FORCED to go to the gym and live up to some politician's view of healthy.. and if I don't, I get to have money taken from me?

No, this isn't social engineering.. *&$*#&!! communists!


Browns is the Browns

... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.

Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 15,015
Likes: 147
F
Legend
Offline
Legend
F
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 15,015
Likes: 147
what if i workout at home? will I be forced to join a gym now?


We don't have to agree with each other, to respect each others opinion.
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 512
J
All Pro
Offline
All Pro
J
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 512
j/c
these are the kind of things that not too many people know about that I hinted to earlier in this thread. There will be more. Simply unreal.

Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 30,822
Likes: 516
A
Legend
OP Offline
Legend
A
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 30,822
Likes: 516
Quote:

what if i workout at home? will I be forced to join a gym now?




Don't ask anyone in congress - they have no clue what they are trying to pass. Plus, since it doesn't apply to them, they don't care - as long as the money comes in.

Page 2 of 2 1 2
DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Tailgate Forum Where can I find the Senate bill on health care?

Link Copied to Clipboard
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5