Here ya go arch. The first link is the one that was introduced by Tom Harkin, the second link is the bill introduced by Max Baucus, and the last link is the list of amendments.
The link I found that had the full text including the Reid amendment is currently not working, so if I find another one I'll let you know.
It'd be nice if we could see the whole bill.......I mean, after all, they are voting on it tomorrow morning. I guess that whole promise to have every bill that gets voted on available for the public for at least 72 hours before the vote wasn't real.
It'd be nice if we could see the whole bill.......I mean, after all, they are voting on it tomorrow morning. I guess that whole promise to have every bill that gets voted on available for the public for at least 72 hours before the vote wasn't real.
The link exists but it's "Broken". Fitting for government I know.
Quote: I guess that whole promise to have every bill that gets voted on available for the public for at least 72 hours before the vote wasn't real
or live on c-span
What really fries my ass is the old "this HAS to be done by Christmas, or we'll never get it done.", and "without health care reform, the gov't. will go bankrupt" (yes, those statements have been made).........and then come to find out the only thing that happens with this passing is a tax increase......the health care reform crap (and it is crap, make no mistake), doesn't kick in until 2014!!!!!
They take our money for 4 years before they spend a cent of it - before any of the "reform" kicks in.
What about the passionate speeches given, saying, basically, every 10 or 20 seconds someone dies from lack of health care - that is why we HAVE TO DO IT NOW..........but then we find out the only NOW in the thing is tax increases - screw the dying. They can wait 4 years - we want the money.
Oh, and congress isn't covered in the bill........according to what I've heard.
But, we do know congress agreed to exempt Nebraska from all future medicaid payments, as long as the senator from Nebraska agreed to vote FOR this pile of dog crap.
Interestingly enough, bribes are illegal for most people. But in washington, I guess that's what you live for.
what is really baffling is all of the "hidden" things in the bill that doesn't get talked about, there are a lot of things I have heard about (and won't repeat as I haven't actually read the bill) and would also like a chance to read the bill and see if some of this stuff is in there
of course the sources I heard this stuff from I don't think would lie, since millions listen to them
If you go to the bottom floor of the Senate, find the broken down stairwell to your left. At the bottom of the stairs you'll find an old disused bathroom. The combination on the door is unknown, but you should be able to pick the lock after a few hours. Once inside the room, you'll find a filing cabinet behind a false wall. Ignore the, "beware of leopard" signs. The file cabinet is fireproof, so you will have to use a acetelene torch to cut open the drawers. Inside you'll find directions to the bill which is currently hidden in Iran under akmedinijad's butt.
What gets me is little detail that have snuck out ..... like the fact that in order to get the good Senator from Nebraska's support ..... any insurance company operating in Nebraska wil be exempt from the new insurance company tax ..... (Mutual of Omaha anyone?) or that pork galore resides within this bill ..... just like every other damn bill that comes out of Waste Central in Washington DC.
Yeah .... it's important ...... it's gotta get done by Christmas .....
We, the American Taxpayers and consumers, are the ones getting "done".
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
I'm half tempted to not pay my estimated taxes next year on hopes there is a revolt where lots of small business decide enough is enough and just quit sending the checks. If hundreds of thousands of small business owners did that, it MIGHT get some attention in Washington; it would be difficult to prosecute and collect taxes if enough people did that I would think.
I know that thought is way out there in left field, but they are going to take even more of my hard earned money next year because of this asinine bill. I've had it. I'm pissed. This country is going down the crapper. And that Nebraska thing just adds fuel to the fire; what a joke.
I know that thought is way out there in left field, but they are going to take even more of my hard earned money next year because of this asinine bill.
AND, we're supposed to believe that they'll "hold the money for 4 years", until the bill that HAD to be done by Christmas actually starts doing anything other than taxing us.
How much you wanna bet that, come 2014, taxes will be raised again to pay for this, because the money they collected for 4 years will be gone?
Yeah, I like that too. Let's see, they have no money now but they are just going to leave this extra pile of cash sitting around until this great health care system is implemented. Riiiiiiiight.
I read that earlier today. I love the tax on indoor tanning; how bizarre. That was the compromise for not taxing cosmetic surgery I believe. What the heck did the tanning business do to tick of the gov't...lol. Must not have given enough free tanning sessions to someones wife or something.
Indoor tanning is bad for you, excessive indoor tanning does horrible things to your skin and can cause skin cancer... people with skin cancer or other tanning related ailments need to be treated under the healthcare bill... this makes the healthcare costs to the government more expensive...
Seriously, as the government becomes more and more responsible for your healthcare, look for anything deemed "bad for you" to become more taboo and have taxes associated with it... The list will be long and will likely hit things we can't even imagine right now but my guess is that it will start with things like fast food, soda, etc.. and ultimately could extend to video games, whole milk, and comfortable funiture.
It's been proven that sex leads to pregnancy, which leads to increased health care costs, and can also lead to having a kid, and that's just another health care constituent to take care of.
Before long you suppose we'll see a "tax" (read: you need to pay the government a fee before you are allowed to have a kid)?
Obama's science czar, has already suggested that people should be implanted with birth control early in life and have to apply to the government for approval to have children. Keep up with this Arch, you are behind. Whatever crazy stupid rediculous idea you can think of, they take seriously and have already thought of it.
My guess is that a crisp unread copy will be laying atop the casket where Teddy Kennedy is buied.
Another will be found under the shrunken, dried up carcass of Robert C. Byrd
Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid have just announced that the Medical Reform Bill of 2009 will be available as a Book on Tape option in April 2010. All proceeds from the sales will be going directly into the "soft landing fund" of defeated Dems in the 2010 election.
The American people will never knowingly adopt Socialism. But under the name of 'liberalism' they will adopt every fragment of the Socialist program, .
Quote: Obama's science czar, has already suggested that people should be implanted with birth control early in life and have to apply to the government for approval to have children. Keep up with this Arch, you are behind. Whatever crazy stupid rediculous idea you can think of, they take seriously and have already thought of it.
Talk about taking responsibility completely out of the hands of people .....
The way to make people act responsibly is not to remove responsibility for their own lives from their own hands .... but rather to require them to face whatever consequences their actions create.
However ... today .... in the name of "compassion" ..... we house, feed, provide medical care for and transport single mothers ... even when they have child after child out of wedlock, and without any requirement of responsibility on the father's part ...... we provide "clean" needles to drug abusers ..... we give people a tax credit for not working very much ...... and have basically created a huge population of people who will be dependant upon the government for generations to come .... because it's their "right".
Tell people that there will be no more welfare ..... no more free health care .... no more government sponsored housing ..... no more free food ....... and that people must do for and provide for themselves, and you'd have panic and riots. Basically, telling people that they have to be adults and stand on their own 2 feet would create chaos.
That's scary.
Maybe we should steralize the politicians .... then we might get some common sense back into the political arena.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
OMG That is the MOST ridiculous thing I have EVER READ in my ENTIRE LIFE. Bringing life into this world is NOT THE GOVT'S JOB TO MANAGE, it is up to an individual man and woman to decide.
Eff OBAMA and his SCIENCE GURU if that is what they think. The bible outlines morality, and is not to be redefined by Obamaeffer. Sorry I am trying really hard to be good, but that pisses me off.
OMG That is the MOST ridiculous thing I have EVER READ in my ENTIRE LIFE. Bringing life into this world is NOT THE GOVT'S JOB TO MANAGE, it is up to an individual man and woman to decide.
Eff OBAMA and his SCIENCE GURU if that is what they think. The bible outlines morality, and is not to be redefined by Obamaeffer. Sorry I am trying really hard to be good, but that pisses me off.
Just a side note to the science czars thinking - I thought most Democrats supported a woman's right to choose (I.E. Killing innocent souls of babies). Wouldn't this be taking the choice away from women?
Obama said long ago that we should judge him by the company he keeps.
Anita Dunn - fan of Chairman Mao - murdered 60 million Van Jones - self proclaimed Communist John Holdren - see article above Cas Sunstein - just as radical as the others list goes on and on.
I am fairly compfortable judging Obama by the company he keeps. He's just not going to like the verdict.
That was fantastic. And the fact that I'm laughing while sharing Ballpeen's observation; I don't know if that's sad, or the reality of it is just that horrible.
As Jon McCain has said, "This is the biggest scam ever purported on the American people!"
Big Jon is right.
There was NO reason this had to be passed before Christmas except that the work of the Obamanation is not complete and they need to ram a few more pieces of "socialist" legislation down our throats before they lose the super majority. Next up, the 1st and 2nd amendment!
Back to the healthcare (cough, cough) reform....
Of all the crap in this bill the "penalty tax" could be its own undoing, or as some have wisely surmised, will require additional taxes to pay for it! As part of the bill it has written that those who don't invoke some health insurance will be penalized about $750/$1500 per year. Well, hell, that is about 15% of my out-of-pocket health insurance expense for the year, even if nobody gets sick in my family for the entire year. Hmmm, that means I save 85% by not paying for coverage.
Since I am guaranteed coverage no matter what happens, why should I pay the premium for years and years before myself, or a family member gets sick and needs major coverage? It seems to me that it would be much cheaper to simply pay the "penalty tax" and routine sick calls (strep throat, bronchitous, etc) out of pocket.
I am betting that ALOT of people will take this position meaning that the influx of NEW healthcare premiums will be less than estimated throwing their long-term cost basis out of wack. Thus more taxes will be needed leaving even less money in your pockets...so much for the economic recoevery!
Add to this that "IF" the penalty employers will pay by not providing coverage to their employees is "less than" their cost of providing said coverage, isn't it reasonable to assume that employers will start dropping coverage and simply pay the penalty as it will be better for their bottom line? I think so. This can only mean less companies providing insurance and more people faced with eating their full health insurance premiums themselves! Again even less money in your pockets! Will this help the economy?
Overall this healthcare bill is going to cost the American public much more than is currently being estimated by the Congressional Budget Office. Your health insurance premiums are going up, your taxes are going up, and the economy will be going down, down, down, as consumers will have less and less money to spend at their own discretion.
Taxation without respresentation has returned people, and the ill-informed, lazy masses, voted for it!
Quote: ...meaning that the influx of NEW healthcare premiums will be less than estimated throwing their long-term cost basis out of wack.
This is the crux of obamanomics. They count these insanely inflated estimates as if it were cash in their pockets. Just like the "money generated by closing tax loopholes for major oil companies" and "the savings for eliminating medicaid fraud". Anybody that thinks that the actual amounts (if any) generated from these initiatives will be anywhere near what the BS artists in this administration are stating is an idiot.
And into the forest I go, to lose my mind and find my soul. - John Muir
I have avoided most of the political threads due to the assinine replies the left leaning posters use. But I find it funny that not one of the Obama supporters are even replying to this thread. Peen is more right than I would like to believe. Our country has been taken over by the very party (communist) that our fathers and their fathers fought against. The youth in this country are ignorant to facts, TRUE facts, not ones proposed by college professors with the same agenda as the left politicians. They voted for this fool because they thought it was cool. The media made Bush the villian, and used their influence to skew facts and premote socialism and all it entails, all the while discrediting anybody who premoted the truth.
This administration is so anti- American it is painful to see. Many claimed Bush was power hungry and arrogant, the media was the vehicle which was used. Now we have the most arrogant, egotistical, self absorbed president in the history of this country. He lies constantly and the media turns their head.
All great civilizations have disappeared eventually, and many for the same reasons. Our country is being dismantled by communist, facists, and the lemmings in the congress that care more about their own power than the country or it's people.
When poll after poll prove that the people of this country are not in agreement with what the government, specifically the Democrats, are doing, yet the leaders of both the House and Senate turn their noses up at them, something needs to be done. Reid, Pelosi, and Obama could give a rat's behind what the people want. They are all about what they want.
I never would incite violence, but if it is what it would take to restore the Constitution and what it stands for, I would become as violent as needed. I believe there are many others across this nation who are at that point already. So all who want to come here and defend this jackahole Obama, remember you are part of the problem. And if it ever did come down to violence, I wouldn't want to be on the opposite side of true Americans. And if you think that what this administration and the Democratic leaders are doing to our country is American, then you are a fool and will pay the price for your blind worship of this travesty called Obama.
I spoke with my cousin and her husband over Christmas. They voted for Obama. They both apologized for voting for him. No prodding from me. They said "if we'd have known, there's no way we would've voted for him".
My guess is a lot of "working" people are rethinking their vote. Just my guess.
Quote: Our country has been taken over by the very party (communist) that our fathers and their fathers fought against. The youth in this country are ignorant to facts, TRUE facts, not ones proposed by college professors with the same agenda as the left politicians. They voted for this fool because they thought it was cool. The media made Bush the villian, and used their influence to skew facts and premote socialism and all it entails, all the while discrediting anybody who premoted the truth.
This administration is so anti- American it is painful to see. Many claimed Bush was power hungry and arrogant, the media was the vehicle which was used. Now we have the most arrogant, egotistical, self absorbed president in the history of this country. He lies constantly and the media turns their head.
The last two administrations have really made the whole charade of partisanship rather clear.
Look no further than the above comments...you read nutty stuff like this every day...Obama is a communist and he hates America and is dismantling it...just lunacy that's borne out of word-of-mouth partisanship.
Make no mistake about it -- thus far, he's been a bad president...top 5 worst all-time bad.
But he's barely - and I mean BARELY - different than Bush....if you listed each one of their actions and put them all together...it would be pretty difficult to discern who was who.
And yet...you have two sides that defend one and act like the other is the face of evil.
When we finally establish that any and all presidents are going to be massive failures under the current political system we have, things may change...if we continue on this path...we'll be arguing over which president was worse while we assemble toys for Chinese kids.
Quote: Obama is a communist and he hates America and is dismantling it...just lunacy that's borne out of word-of-mouth partisanship.
Beleive what you want, but to say that he is not a communist, when everything he does leans that way is nonsense. Facist might be a better description. Arrogant jackahole is better IMO.
I see with my own eyes, I don't need talking heads to convince me. The guy is a liar. Comparing his love for the country with Bush's is a farce. Nice try though.
![[Linked Image from i190.photobucket.com]](http://i190.photobucket.com/albums/z33/booger52/phpGGRdhwAM.jpg)
![[Linked Image from s2.excoboard.com]](http://s2.excoboard.com/forums/25521/user/302752/484538.gif)
![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
