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I still have ???s about him being the VPF for the same reason that Toad mentioned along with some of my own. For one CC hasn't put together a program/system that can be identified as successful. Secondly, the VPF is going to have influence on personnel decisions.........big influence........and I don't trust CC to turn this around. Finally, I am of the opinion that we really need someone who gives us credibility, and I don't think that CC is that guy.
As Toad said, I understand why he's a candidate, but I certainly wouldn't hire him until Holmgren, Acorsi, and Wolfe told me no.
Against logic,the most effective armor is willful ignorance.
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Just realized why I don't care for him: He reminds me way too much of Savage.
Some good things, some bad ones, and when he went looking for a job in the league somewhere, he got no takers. He's on TV, Opie is on radio.
Yeah.....my mind is made up. I'm not going to be excited if we name CC the "Czar."
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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Nice comparison...lol. To add to that I see alot of similarities between the two, because neither of them ever really stuck to a building plan. Savage started a decent plan in the beginning, but abandoned it to go after the "brass" ring. Charlie started a plan to build the team around Carr, but then never acquired any quality OL for him to develop behind.
I honestly do not want Charlie unless Holmgren, Wolfe, and Acorsi say no...........at that point I'll take what I can get...lol.
Against logic,the most effective armor is willful ignorance.
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The mistakes you pointed out that Savage and Charlie made, and you hit them on the nose, may not have been made if there were someone above them to put that sort of thing in check.
A Czar would have set down with the GM and wanted to hear, and have much input into, the philosophy going into FA and the draft each off-season and make sure the vision was sound before moves were made. This is the kind of thing a guy like Collins could not have done to help Savage since he had only a business but no football background.
If I'm Lerner I want to hear from a potential Czar candidate that his vision is to build from the inside out and that his hiring of a GM would be made toward fulfilling that vision.
I am so surprised at director of player personel and GM types who have a philosophy and vision to "make do" in the trenches by obtaining players who are iffy (inexpensive?) at those critical positions. The lesson and the opportunity to learn from it has been there over and over, yet these personnel people fail to learn it as they fall in love with the next big skill player.
#gmstrong
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I'm much more excited about Charlie Casserly in a CZAR position than I am in the GM position.
He's not Holmgren, which I would easily give both the President of Football Operations and the GM position to if needed. Holmgren has the experience to work with pro personnel, college scouting and the coaching staff to get things done. He would rely on his scouts to scout, and stay in the building making sure the different divisions are working cohesively.
Casserly, on the other hand, would be great in terms of overseeing a GM, along with the GM's relationship with the pro personnel and college scouting units. But I think we'd need a GM under him that can work closely with the coaching staff. Casserly's focus should be coordinating between those groups, but not running any of them. If we capable people underneath him, I think he would be fantastic as a Czar.
The good thing is that we are looking at experienced football people. I think the difference between whether we get a Casserly or Holmgren is the money that Lerner is willing to give.
My biggest fear, IMO, is that Lerner is in the interview room PLEADING with the potential candidates to make it work with Mangini and staff. And I can only hope that ALL of them say no.
While Lerner has been willing to spend in the past, this is a big moment in his ownership for me. If he's able to swallow Mangini's contract, while shelling out the necessary money to get an EXPERIENCED football executive, and new GM (if necessary) and coach, then I'll continue to support him. But if he hires a low-life executive who swears it can work with Mangini, he's lost my support.
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My biggest fear, IMO, is that Lerner is in the interview room PLEADING with the potential candidates to make it work with Mangini and staff. And I can only hope that ALL of them say no.
Rest easy, man.
Lerner won't bring in a Czar then dictate to them that they keep Mangini. By accepting that he has to get a true football guy to make all the decisions, he's throwing up the surrender flag on his own way of doing things. That means the Czar WILL call all the shots, so it'll be up to that guy to decide Mangini's fate, not Lerner's.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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My biggest fear, IMO, is that Lerner is in the interview room PLEADING with the potential candidates to make it work with Mangini and staff. And I can only hope that ALL of them say no.
Rest easy, man.
Lerner won't bring in a Czar then dictate to them that they keep Mangini. By accepting that he has to get a true football guy to make all the decisions, he's throwing up the surrender flag on his own way of doing things. That means the Czar WILL call all the shots, so it'll be up to that guy to decide Mangini's fate, not Lerner's.
I hope you're right, and I understand that when the Czar gets here all of the decisions will be his. I just hope Lerner doesn't pick the lower-level candidate that says, "Yeah, I'll come and be your Czar and give Mangini and Co. another year to see if we can work together."
Obviously, if someone like Holmgren or Casserly comes, then we don't have to worry about it. But if we strike out with the experienced guys, then what?
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But if we strike out with the experienced guys, then what?
We won't. 
An owner with amazingly deep pockets and a willingness to spend it combined with total control over the ENTIRE organization?
Casserly wants back in the league and we'd be his best option.
We'll get a veteran guy.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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toads right, if you go by history, Lerner has always been a hands off owner.. He hires, then gets out of the way.. my understanding is, he does the same with AV..
the only time he gets involved is when the train comes off the tracks.. exactly as it should be... IMO
#GMSTRONG
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if you dont like what you have interviewed or they dont want it then you want until the offseason and target 4 guys you couldlnt talk to during the season. Those residing in Arizona, Atlanta, Phili and Pitt.
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Casserly wanted the GM job before and I could see Holmgreen as VP and Casserly as GM with Mooch as HC. Both are tight with mooch and Casserly has an eye for D talent and Mike has an eye for O especially OL. just a brainstorming 
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But if we strike out with the experienced guys, then what?
We won't.
An owner with amazingly deep pockets and a willingness to spend it combined with total control over the ENTIRE organization?
Casserly wants back in the league and we'd be his best option.
We'll get a veteran guy.
Thank you for calming the ol' nerves 
It's pretty sad that I've been reduced to thinking that our franchise would struggle to bring in top talent not only on the field, but in the front office.
All I want is a structure in place that has everyone working toward a common goal, reporting to one individual that does not also spend his time coaching the team.
My biggest fear is that Mangini and Co. get ANY more time at the helm next season. With the importance of the upcoming draft, and the exceptional amount of talent within it, we can really put the franchise back on solid ground if we have a productive offseason. I do not trust that with Mangini, and the sooner we get someone credible in Berea, the better.
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toads right, if you go by history, Lerner has always been a hands off owner.. He hires, then gets out of the way.. my understanding is, he does the same with AV..
the only time he gets involved is when the train comes off the tracks.. exactly as it should be... IMO
This is a good thing in most cases, and I'd rather have that then a Jerry Jones. However, in our most recent case, it absolutely killed us. Lerner had NO IDEA how bad it was between Kokinis and Mangini, and if I were him I'd be awfully upset at Mangini as well.
I know he hasn't said so publicly, but I really believe he's got to have some sort of anger harbored at Mangini for screwing more than one thing up in his short tenure here.
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However, in our most recent case, it absolutely killed us. Lerner had NO IDEA how bad it was between Kokinis and Mangini, and if I were him I'd be awfully upset at Mangini as well.
How could he have an idea.. those two had a long history.. On top of that, Mangini seemed to have pushed hard for Kokinis... so why would Lerner even suspect there would be a problem..
There is way more to that whole story.. way more.. maybe we'll find out someday,, maybe we won't.. dunno
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I know he hasn't said so publicly, but I really believe he's got to have some sort of anger harbored at Mangini for screwing more than one thing up in his short tenure here.
The thing I'm hanging my hopes on is that last year, Lerner seemed to support Savage and RAC at this point as well... then looked what happened.. I'm betting the same will be for Mangini but this time, I bet it's the new VP/GM or whatever title.. top dawg of football, that does the firing... Just a guess
#GMSTRONG
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Daniel Patrick Moynahan
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Damanshot
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However, in our most recent case, it absolutely killed us. Lerner had NO IDEA how bad it was between Kokinis and Mangini, and if I were him I'd be awfully upset at Mangini as well.
How could he have an idea.. those two had a long history.. On top of that, Mangini seemed to have pushed hard for Kokinis... so why would Lerner even suspect there would be a problem..
There is way more to that whole story.. way more.. maybe we'll find out someday,, maybe we won't.. dunno
The point is that there was no one in the building to even hint to Lerner that there was a problem early on. Someone there needs to report to the owner, even if he is hands off. I'm sure if Kokinis and Mangini had such a huge problem, someone was bound to notice. That someone should have alerted Lerner ASAP.
Don't get me wrong ... I'm all for hands off. But there's hands off and there's TOO hands off. Hopefully, if we get the right czar in here, none of that will matter.
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But if we strike out with the experienced guys, then what?
We won't.
An owner with amazingly deep pockets and a willingness to spend it combined with total control over the ENTIRE organization?
Casserly wants back in the league and we'd be his best option.
We'll get a veteran guy.
we might be his best option,but is he our best option?
... and I'm no Casserly hater BTW. He would prolly be better than any other GM we have had so far.
Also, I understand the ire felt toward Mangini on this board. But if you look at what he has done you will see he has positioned the on-field team in the best possible position going forward.
11 picks
slashed salaries
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casserly said he hadnt spoke or didnt plan to speak to anyone about the browns job. I dont think he was being truthful and he actually sounded kinda angry lol
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As a potential HC,, how come Jim Fassels name isn't brought up..
#GMSTRONG
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Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
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Casserly wanted the GM job before and I could see Holmgreen as VP and Casserly as GM with Mooch as HC. Both are tight with mooch and Casserly has an eye for D talent and Mike has an eye for O especially OL. just a brainstorming
Dream. Scenario.
I'd somehow like to figure out how to keep Ryan too. I not only think he's a very good D coordinator, I think he's going to make a good head coach someday.
LOL - The Rish will be upset with this news as well. KS just doesn't prioritize winning...
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I'd somehow like to figure out how to keep Ryan too. I not only think he's a very good D coordinator, I think he's going to make a good head coach someday.
Hopefully, Monday, November 23, 2009 (as Interim Coach).
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He is a HC in Las Vegas I believe.
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Never liked Fassel. Nobody in the league would give him a sniff despite a PR and self-promotion tour that'd make a WWF wrestler envious.
No to Fassel.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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He is a HC in Las Vegas I believe.
Oh, I know where he is,, I just don't know why nobody brought him up.. He coached the Giants to a superbowl once..,
#GMSTRONG
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Damanshot
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Never liked Fassel. Nobody in the league would give him a sniff despite a PR and self-promotion tour that'd make a WWF wrestler envious.
In and of itself, lack of interest by other teams isn't a reason to discount him altogether.. Got any other reasons...
I'm not pimping him,, just wondering
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Um.....D, lack of interest despite his blitzing PR campaign speaks VOLUMES. 
You'd think with that Super Bowl appearance under his belt it'd give him some interest right? It hasn't.
Of course I could tell you I've never liked him, but my opinion won't change your mind.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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No thanks Chuck. We can do better.
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But if we strike out with the experienced guys, then what?
We won't.
An owner with amazingly deep pockets and a willingness to spend it combined with total control over the ENTIRE organization?
Casserly wants back in the league and we'd be his best option.
We'll get a veteran guy.
He did a very good job in assessing their quarterback situation and trading for a veteran with promise (obviously Schaub, people the man is playing his lights out this year and is healthy still) instead of attempting to draft a QB in the 1st or 2nd round again and halting their development. That team is very primed now (at least competitive at the moment against the best) because of a very good selection of choices he made. He seems to be a better option than Holmgren in my opinion. He's I Think Clemdawgs version of the ballsy, yet very tact, intelligent GM we need. I know he'd bring in a good coach at least who can manage a damn clock. 
Politicians are puppets, y'all. Let's get Geppetto!
Formerly 4yikes2yoshi0
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He did a very good job in assessing their quarterback situation and trading for a veteran with promise (obviously Schaub, people the man is playing his lights out this year and is healthy still) instead of attempting to draft a QB in the 1st or 2nd round again and halting their development.
As noted once before, Casserly was forced out in 2006.
The Texans traded for Schaub in 2007.
But if you're going to talk about his drafts, he spent the #1 pick on Carr, then put no offensive linemen around him for several years.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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Ummm, uhh, well he would've traded for him if wasn't forced out I'm sure  Okay you caught me. I'm tired and not doing my homework on anyone and just talking out of my ass right now.
Politicians are puppets, y'all. Let's get Geppetto!
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I've done it. I'll do it again. Don't sweat it.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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most likely you read my post at some point which i did pretty much the same thing....
forgot to thank toad for correcting me on that one, so i'll do it here.
#gmstrong
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Bah. Like I told Dawson, we're all wrong at some point. I've misspoken before, and I'll do it again. It's good we all keep each other in check when it comes to making sure info is correct.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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Bah. Like I told Dawson, we're all wrong at some point. I've misspoken before, and I'll do it again. It's good we all keep each other in check when it comes to making sure info is correct.
Well you may end wrong on that Young debate we had a few years back cause He is actually starting to look like an NFL QB. You watching MNF?
Go Browns!!![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/BrowniePoints/AndersonSnowPic.jpg)
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