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I can think of several reasons not to draft Malcom Jenkins...
Quinn Pitcock
A.J. Hawk
Bobby Carpenter
Mike Doss
Donte Whitner
Chris Gamble
Vernon Gholston (probably...)
Hawk Whitner and Gamble are far from busts. Gamble is the number opne corner on a playoff team...
I agree with what a few other people say....Gamble, Whitner, Aj Hawk, Santonio Holmes, Nick Mangold, Anthony Gonzalez, Ashton Youboty, Mike Jenkins, Will Smith...Might not be SUPER STARS....but all have put in SOLID NFL careers at this point.
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Or Hawk or Gamble....
That and Mike Doss was like a mid-late 2nd round pick, and was bad in coverage..... I don't think you can demand a stud at that point...
Politicians are puppets, y'all. Let's get Geppetto!
Formerly 4yikes2yoshi0
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I wish we would get something official about Ryan being our DC
Go Browns!!![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/BrowniePoints/AndersonSnowPic.jpg)
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Legend
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Is Donnie Nickey still playing,....??
As a matter of fact, EVERY defensive starter on the 2002 NC Team was drafted into the NFL.
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. I think that those are all players that teams in the low teens might want. A team like the Texans may be looking to snag one of the OT's like Monroe or Jason Smith.
The 49er's might wanna move up to get Crabtree...and who knows, someone might wanna come up and get Wells, obviously if Stafford is around, that would be really nice.
I think theres a 40% chance that we could find a partner to move down a few spots, maybe package a player like Winslow and get another 2nd..
So you're suggesting we send the #5 pick and our Pro bowl tight end in exchange for a pick in the low teens and a pick in the late 40s?  For reference: http://www.nfldraftblitz.com/pick_value_chart.htm
Let's be honest, there's almost no chance a trade will occur. In fact, I can't remember the last time a top 5 pick was traded for a pick in the 7-15 range, and trades like this are getting even less likely due to the high salaries that top draft picks currently demand. It's not going to happen, it doesn't happen, and talking about it won't make it happen. Top 5 picks are more punishment than they are gold in this league.
The Ohio State talk is also ridiculous, I'm not sure how you decide every non-pro bowler is a bust.
~Lyuokdea
~Lyuokdea
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Does the draft chart factor in how injury prone a player is? I don't think Winslow's value is overly high, not that he isnt a good player. At some point all the early injuries are gonna keep him outta games, and not just practice. If we could get a 2nd rounder for him period I would jump on it.
When you look at the whole KW2 picture,If you can use him to move around, move up from the 2nd round back into the first, I think its an option that the new guys will look at.
IMO KW2 has hit that wall where all his injuries are going to bother him badly...
Like I said, it depends on our draft board, and whos available. If the guy we want is not a guy worth taking at 5 and a team wants to deal it could happen. Hey moving down 3 spots for a fourth isnt a bad move. It doesn't have to be a blockbuster.
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Especially not as deep as I believe this draft is. Everybody down to # 10 is gonna get a stud.
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Especially not as deep as I believe this draft is. Everybody down to # 10 is gonna get a stud.
And we only have 4 picks...uggh...
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1) The list was strictly pertaining to defensive players. I was not taking offensive players into account. i.e. Eddie George, Nick Mangold, etc.
2) I consider a bust to be someone not playing up to their intended value. Hawk only having a solid career thus far makes him a bust. He hasn't played like a top ten pick, neither has Donte Whitner. Quinn Pitcock is out of the league. Mike Doss playing 17 games in the past three years makes him a bust.
My point is that in no way am I interested in drafting a defensive player from a school where the prospects have underperformed.
Excuse me for wanting a top ten pick to play like a top ten pick.
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All Pro
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Ithougth we had five???? can somebody help on this ????
Anayway, I do feel that we will acquire some more. Whether that that invovles DA, Winslow, BE, Davis, etc.,??????? ANd they may not be 1st,2nd, or even 3rd rounders,.....I just think somehow we get some more picks.
Born and breed with OSU, App. State alumni, but bleed orange and brown.
Go ARMY......Beat Navy!!!!!!
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Ithougth we had five???? can somebody help on this ????
Anayway, I do feel that we will acquire some more. Whether that that invovles DA, Winslow, BE, Davis, etc.,??????? ANd they may not be 1st,2nd, or even 3rd rounders,.....I just think somehow we get some more picks.
We have our 1st, 2nd, 4th and 6th. Our 3rd was traded in the Martin Rucker deal, our 5th was traded in the Paul Hubbard deal and our 7th was traded for Travis Daniels if I remember right.
We're... we're good?
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That seventh is really the back breaker.  
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Davis is an UFA, and we'd be lucky to get a seventh for him even if we could trade him.
Our trade value right now lies in DA, BE, and KW. All of their values are down because of the subpar years, and KW probably doesn't have more than four or five years left which also hurts his value.
Might be able to get a first for BE, but other than that you're looking at mid-round value for each.
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That seventh is really the back breaker.
lol... I'm sure Romeo was ticked off about that one.
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That seventh is really the back breaker.
Well, can you really consider any of the picks we traded anything but flushed down the toilet? Let's see... Martin Rucker, Paul Hubbard, Travis Daniels... them's some good returns.
We're... we're good?
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Who is Paul Hubbard? Was he the WR from Wis? Is Hubbard still on the PS?
I'd say some scout was having a really bad day at Wis's pro day to recommend trading future picks to get him.
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Who is Paul Hubbard? Was he the WR from Wis? Is Hubbard still on the PS?
I'd say some scout was having a really bad day at Wis's pro day to recommend trading future picks to get him.
Yeah, he was the guy we kept on the PS all year before the last week of the season when we signed him from the PS to sit on the bench.
Traded a 2009 5th for a 2008 6th. Another glorious move by Phil.
We're... we're good?
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Does the draft chart factor in how injury prone a player is? I don't think Winslow's value is overly high, not that he isnt a good player. At some point all the early injuries are gonna keep him outta games, and not just practice. If we could get a 2nd rounder for him period I would jump on it.
yeah, that doesn't make any sense..... if you thought you could get a second for him, then why would you trade your #5 and him in order to get a mid first and a second? The math doesn't add up...
From the trade value chart (which almost all GMs use), the #5 overall pick is worth more than a #15 and #45 BY ITSELF why you would randomly throw winslow into that makes no sense whatsoever.
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Hey moving down 3 spots for a fourth isnt a bad move. It doesn't have to be a blockbuster.
Yes, it's not a bad move...it's a TERRIBLE move. What happens when the guy you were targeting gets taken up in those intermediate three picks? Despite all the experts and analysis, we have absolutely no clue how different teams value players until the draft happens. On the morning of the draft, dropping down to take guys such as Derrick Harvey, Donte Whitner, Demarcus Ware, and Reggie Williams all would have sounded really smart...except they all would have been gone by the time you picked, because other teams valued them more highly than the media.
It's one thing when you are trading down only one pick and you know who the team is going up to get (see baltimore/cleveland deal in 2006), it's a completely different scenario to move down multiple picks in exchange for almost nothing and possibly miss out on the guys you are targeting.
Another common but poor system of reasoning is that a guy isn't "worth" the #5 pick, but is the guy you are targeting. If he is the guy you are coveting the most, then why the hell would you think he's worth a lower pick than other guys on the board?
People seem to do mock drafts under the impression that every other team is always going to take the "common logic" pick, and there is no variability in how players are valued. If that was true, then of course game theory would allow you, as the one conscious actor to highly manipulate the draft. However, that's not the way the world works.
~Lyuokdea
~Lyuokdea
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Legend
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That seventh is really the back breaker.
Well, can you really consider any of the picks we traded anything but flushed down the toilet? Let's see... Martin Rucker, Paul Hubbard, Travis Daniels... them's some good returns.
I thought the trades were stupid last year, but you saying they were flushed down the toilet after one season is a bit premature. Rucker was hurt, then slow to pickup the offense. He has very good speed and size to go along with great hands. I would never traded away a third to pick him up in the 4th but he might be worth it in the long run. Hubbard was considered a huge project. He is a great athlete but unfortunately has questionable hands and runs poor routes. I would never give away anything for a guy this low in the draft. Travis Daniels at least was on the roster. That's more then I can say for most seventh rounders. Personally I would have rather kept the pick and get a stiff off the street.
#gmstrong
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I can think of several reasons not to draft Malcom Jenkins...
Quinn Pitcock
A.J. Hawk
Bobby Carpenter
Mike Doss
Donte Whitner
Chris Gamble
Vernon Gholston (probably...)
Hawk Whitner and Gamble are far from busts. Gamble is the number opne corner on a playoff team...
I agree with what a few other people say....Gamble, Whitner, Aj Hawk, Santonio Holmes, Nick Mangold, Anthony Gonzalez, Ashton Youboty, Mike Jenkins, Will Smith...Might not be SUPER STARS....but all have put in SOLID NFL careers at this point.
j/k....this is one of the dumbest arguments I've heard in a while
Gamble - All rookie 1st team, lead team in interceptions 3 of last 4 years, signed $50M contract....sounds like he was worth the draft pick
Whitner - 3 year starter, average player - 80 year Marv Levy drafted him a lot earlier then most people expected him going
Carpenter - Bust
Pitcock - Bust..."retired"
AJ Hawk - Average thus far, not bad, not great
Holmes - star in the making...worth the pick
Mangold - Made pro bowl - 3 year starter
Gonzalez - star in the making...worth the pick
Michael Jenkins - finally has a real QB and he had his best year....TBD
Will Smith - Pro Bowler, recently signed $70M contract extension...i'd say he's worth it
So are we saying not to draft OSU players because they bust???? Out of the players chosen in the first round, 6 out of the 9 players IMO were worth the choice. Hawk and Whitner are starters and Carpenter's a bust....Gholston is still a work in progress. 6 out 9....find another school who produced that many first round picks and what is their %?
Don't forget all the O-lineman drafted in the later rounds or undrafted that are also starting. Oh, and Winfield, Nate Clements, Terry Glenn, David Boston (before he went crazy), Eddie George, Ryan Pickett, Joey Galloway, Orlando Pace, etc...
If you don't want to draft Jenkins because you think he stinks or because you don't think there is value there, make that argument, not because he went to OSU. I'll take OSU's first round bust rate versus any other major program in the country.
I'm coming home, I'm coming home, tell the world I'm coming home
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I can think of several reasons not to draft Malcom Jenkins...
Quinn Pitcock
A.J. Hawk
Bobby Carpenter
Mike Doss
Donte Whitner
Chris Gamble
Vernon Gholston (probably...)
Hawk Whitner and Gamble are far from busts. Gamble is the number opne corner on a playoff team...
I agree with what a few other people say....Gamble, Whitner, Aj Hawk, Santonio Holmes, Nick Mangold, Anthony Gonzalez, Ashton Youboty, Mike Jenkins, Will Smith...Might not be SUPER STARS....but all have put in SOLID NFL careers at this point.
j/k....this is one of the dumbest arguments I've heard in a while
Gamble - All rookie 1st team, lead team in interceptions 3 of last 4 years, signed $50M contract....sounds like he was worth the draft pick
Whitner - 3 year starter, average player - 80 year Marv Levy drafted him a lot earlier then most people expected him going
Carpenter - Bust
Pitcock - Bust..."retired"
AJ Hawk - Average thus far, not bad, not great
Holmes - star in the making...worth the pick
Mangold - Made pro bowl - 3 year starter
Gonzalez - star in the making...worth the pick
Michael Jenkins - finally has a real QB and he had his best year....TBD
Will Smith - Pro Bowler, recently signed $70M contract extension...i'd say he's worth it
So are we saying not to draft OSU players because they bust???? Out of the players chosen in the first round, 6 out of the 9 players IMO were worth the choice. Hawk and Whitner are starters and Carpenter's a bust....Gholston is still a work in progress. 6 out 9....find another school who produced that many first round picks and what is their %?
Don't forget all the O-lineman drafted in the later rounds or undrafted that are also starting. Oh, and Winfield, Nate Clements, Terry Glenn, David Boston (before he went crazy), Eddie George, Ryan Pickett, Joey Galloway, Orlando Pace, etc...
If you don't want to draft Jenkins because you think he stinks or because you don't think there is value there, make that argument, not because he went to OSU. I'll take OSU's first round bust rate versus any other major program in the country.
Below is a list of every defensive player drafted from Ohio State within the first three rounds between the years of 1999 and 2008 (a.k.a. ten years)
NOW LET ME REITERATE: I CONSIDER A "BUST" TO BE SOMEONE WHO HAS NOT PRODUCED ACCORDING TO THEIR DRAFTED POSITION, I.E. A.J. HAWK HAVING AN "AVERAGE CAREER"
Also, they're arranged according to the round drafted in.
Now, let's run down the list.
Vernon Gholston - Rd 1 - 2008 *Top Ten (Wasn't even dressing by year's end. Only a rookie season but it doesn't look good)
A.J. Hawk - Rd 1 - 2006 *Top Ten Average. BUST.
Donte Whitner - Rd 1 - 2006 *Top Ten Has amassed a lot of tackles, but hasn't finished a whole season and has only three takeaways in three years. Has not lived up to top ten billing. BUST.
Will Smith - Rd 1 - 2004 Has produced according to his draft position. PASS.
Bobby Carpenter - Rd 1 - 2006 Averages half a sack a year. BUST.
Chris Gamble - Rd 1 - 2004 Has produced according to his draft position. PASS.
Nate Clements - Rd 1 - 2001 Has played according to his draft status. PASS.
Ryan Pickett - Rd 1 - 2001 Has been a serviceable starter. BUST.
Ahmed Plummer - Rd 1 - 2000 Out of league. BUST.
Antoine Winfield - Rd 1 - 1999 Has played according to his draft position. PASS.
Andy Katzenmoyer - Rd 1 - 1999 Out of league. BUST.
Mike Doss - Rd 2 - 2003 …BUST.
Quinn Pitcock - Rd 3 - 2007 Out of the league. BUST.
Ashton Youboty - Rd 3 - 2006 Has played in nineteen of a possible forty eight games. BUST.
Anthony Schlegel - Rd 3 - 2006 Out of league. BUST.
Dustin Fox - Rd 3 - 2005 Has played in twelve of a possible sixty-four games. BUST.
Tim Anderson - Rd 3 - 2004 Out of league. BUST.
Darrion Scott - Rd 3 - 2004 Out of league. BUST.
Kenny Peterson - Rd 3 - 2003 Has seven sacks in six years, but only one start. BUST.
Cie Grant - Rd 3 - 2003 Out of league. BUST.
Derek Ross - Rd 3 - 2002 Out of league. BUST.
4/11 first rounders pass. The flip side to this is that three of those four are corners.
0/1 second rounders pass.
0/9 third rounders pass. Kenny Peterson is debatable, but in general most of them are out of the league.
Those are the facts. Granted the most pertinent class is the first round, and three of the only successful four players are corners. After looking this up I’m less wary of Malcolm Jenkins. However, I’d still prefer better than ~25% success rate.
And for the poster who said they’d take OSU’s bust % over any other school, that number currently stands at 81% BUST (defensively speaking, of course).
The argument in theory also holds weight. Quarterbacks from Utah, Hawaii, and Texas Tech are consistently labeled as underwhelming players in the NFL. If a program consistently provides underwhelming professional players on one side of the ball, it is something to consider.
If anything though, I definitely won’t be rooting for us to take any OSU front seven players after making this list…
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...dang quotes are broken...
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DAWGS,
Just seen the report on "Beanie" and the word is "Beanie" is the best of the RB's coming out tool wise but his taking it to the next level of battling the dings is the question...........Moreno is thought to go earlier.
TRADE EDWARDS!!!!!!Draft Beanie-Laurinaitis and Robiskie
DAWGS-The Draft is approaching, time to make some moves. GO Browns09!!!!!!!!
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After taking a revised look at the list, lengthened to twelve years syphoned down to first round corners, here's what i've got.
Five Drafted, four successful (Clements, Winfield, Gamble, Shawn Springs, and Ahmed Plummer).
So it looks like, defensively speaking, a corner might be looking like the only buckeye position worth drafting.
Although a buckeye corner hasn't been taken in five years, and I'd still rather see us go front seven. But that's getting away from stats and into my own personal opinion...
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I'm not just saying this because I'm an OSU homer (although we both know I am..lol), but I think Jenkins and possibly Beannie became possibilities with this hire
While I wouldn't mind Jenkins..we need LB help also..I posted in the other thread CB's who will be available..
Wells worries me a lot..he gets dinged way too much ..and at the pro level he's goning to take shots he's never felt before..how's he gonna last?
I'm not very high on him..
Everybody say: TRADE DOWN!!!!
I agree AD we should trade down "IF" possible. Teams tend to stay away from the top 10 players for several reasons. all of which you know.
The point I want to rasie is this. Fans constantly are saying that this team needs an identity, the way you establish an identity is by having a cornerstone player on either side of the ball. At this juncture I believe that we have that player on offense in the form of BQ, but that is still a huge question mark.
I would LOVE to tarde down and garner picks, but if I see a player on the board that is what I hope will be that cornerstone guy I go for him. It obviously needs to be a LBer, as much as Rogers is the cornerstone of the line we need the conerstone of our LB core.
I can see us moving BE and I actually think that the Colts would be a very likely trading partner. Harrison is on his last leg, and PM is closer to the end then the beginning. Don't get me wrong here I'm not kicking dirt in on PM, but he has some miles on his tires. I love Harrison and always have. He is a SU guy and well I am a huge SU fan. JB came from there as well as ED. I have been a fan since.
I look for the Browns to try to re-sign BE and then deal him. If he where a better route runner his value would be much better but if we could make a deal with the Colts for their 1st, he would be on the next bus out.
Finally I think it is of the utmost importance that EM and the GM strike quickley they have 1 year to get it together. The schedule will be kind this year. With the talent we have we should be able to win, garner experience and improve the overall talent at the same time. We will not compete well enough in our own division to get anywhere but then again you don't go from 4-12 to top tear and as painful as I find it, Pitt and the Ravens are just that right now.
JMHThoughts
BTTB
BTTB
AKA Upbeat Dawg
Can't believe I am in a group that is comprised of the best NOT just fans but people on the planet.
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I look for the Browns to try to re-sign BE and then deal him
No way...Irresponsible Cap Management...New team will do the Long Term Inking...
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The schedule will be kind this year. With the talent we have we should be able to win, garner experience and improve the overall talent at the same time. We will not compete well enough in our own division to get anywhere but then again you don't go from 4-12 to top tear and as painful as I find it, Pitt and the Ravens are just that right now.
I wouldn't be so sure about this...
There's much to do this spring...And other than Pitt...We've always played Baltimore tough...Hell...Even with the falling ship this year we just about popped em' game 1 in Cleveland...Our biggest problem's been blowin' leads...In 07 we had em' in Pitt at halftime pretty securely...It's "Finishing" that's hurt us...
Mangini indicates sticking with the 3-4...Also sharing a closely related offensive philosophy...That means no major breaking up of what's here...This should and could be a smooth transition...And coupled with the 2009 schedule...It's possible we hang...
Like I said...There's alot of work to do...For everyone...Need to see what we look like after FA and the Draft...
Go Browns!!!
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All Pro
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Right off the top of my head I can think of 3 longhorns who have busted according to position drafted. Vince Young, Cedric Benson, Micheal Huff So I guess they are a bad school to draft from too. 
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Mike Doss - Rd 2 - 2003 …BUST.
Opie...I'm not even sure if your the one that put the list of OSU busts together...BUT...just a question to whomever did post the list...
Is a bust someone who has not made the pro-bowl?
I picked out one player on the list and looked him up...Mike Doss...he spent 4 yrs with the Colts, then went to the Viking for a year and was with the Bengals last season....that is 6 seasons in the NFL which is probably close to the average length of a DB career in the NFL...he started 43 games.
HOW IS THAT A BUST?
And Doss is still in the NFL though clearly toward the end of his career. Injuries and mileage take a toll on any player. But, if the guy was a bust, he would not have had a 6 yr career in the NFL.
I'm not going to go through every player on this list but whomever put this list out...it's strictly their opinion, not based on research...now you can take Doss off your list.
FOOTBALL IS NOT BASEBALL
Home of the Free, Because of the Brave...
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mac, I have to disagree with you... Quote:
Is a bust someone who has not made the pro-bowl?
No, but that's just my opinion.
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Mike Doss...he spent 4 yrs with the Colts, then went to the Viking for a year and was with the Bengals last season....that is 6 seasons in the NFL which is probably close to the average length of a DB career in the NFL...he started 43 games.
Nobody is happy with a second round draft pick if he only stays with his team for 4 years because they don't think it's a priority to re-sign him.. and in the last 3 years of his 6, he's had 36 total tackles and had 2 ints... that's years 4 through 6 of his career which should be when a draft pick is peaking, not when they are being phased out... His best years were years 1 and 3.. since then it's been all down hill..
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But, if the guy was a bust, he would not have had a 6 yr career in the NFL.
6 years doesn't exactly make him a journeyman... and you might be right if he was a 5th round pick.. but a 2nd round pick? C'mon mac, you expect more than a couple decent years from a 2nd round pick before you ship him off to be sent out to pasture...
I know he was hurt and I'm not clear on what those injuries were, if they were serious then I might recant because I do NOT consider a guy a bust because he has an unfortunate string of injuries (unless possibly he was known to be injury prone coming in)...
yebat' Putin
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Right off the top of my head I can think of 3 longhorns who have busted according to position drafted.
Vince Young, Cedric Benson, Micheal Huff
So I guess they are a bad school to draft from too.
This isn't even a legitimate point. Every school has busts, especially when you look at both sides of the ball. I have twenty-one players on the list, all on one side of the ball. Those stats are a little more thorough than your argument.
Do some research, then come talk to me.
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Joined: Oct 2006
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Practice Squad
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Practice Squad
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Posts: 68 |
Quote:
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Mike Doss - Rd 2 - 2003 …BUST.
Opie...I'm not even sure if your the one that put the list of OSU busts together...BUT...just a question to whomever did post the list...
Is a bust someone who has not made the pro-bowl?
I picked out one player on the list and looked him up...Mike Doss...he spent 4 yrs with the Colts, then went to the Viking for a year and was with the Bengals last season....that is 6 seasons in the NFL which is probably close to the average length of a DB career in the NFL...he started 43 games.
HOW IS THAT A BUST?
And Doss is still in the NFL though clearly toward the end of his career. Injuries and mileage take a toll on any player. But, if the guy was a bust, he would not have had a 6 yr career in the NFL.
I'm not going to go through every player on this list but whomever put this list out...it's strictly their opinion, not based on research...now you can take Doss off your list.
I put the list together. Mike Doss has played in seventeen games out of the past forty-eight. He has not lived up to either his potential or what would be considered to be a productive second round pick.
BUST
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 13,822
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 13,822 |
DC and Opie..
...Just for the record...in Doss's first year with the Colts, only one DB/Safety named to the All Pro team in 2003 had more tackles than Doss (75) and that was Rodney Harrison, NE, with 94.
Also, in 2003, only one Pro Bowl DB/Safety had as many tackles as Doss (75) and that was Corey Chavous who also had 75 tackles.
In Doss' rookie year he started 15 of 15 games and put up his best numbers as a pro..75 tackles and 30 assists, 1 Int, 1 Fumble, 3 Forced Fumbles.
In 2004, Doss only started 9 of 10 games he played in, most likely due to injury. He still put up 42 tackles, 7 ast, 2 Int, 3 Forced Fumbles and 1 sack.
In 2005 Doss started 14 of 15 games, had 57 tackles, 20 asts, 2 Int. Those are good numbers, hardly the numbers of a "bust".
In 2006, Doss only started 4 games of the 6 he appeared in. Doss suffered a torn ACL in the 6th game of the 2006 season and was placed on IR. The Colts did not resign Doss.
There are a lot of NFL players who are plagued by injury and have their careers shortened due to injury. IMO, that does not make a player a bust.
There was little doubt that Doss was a great 2nd round pick for the Colts in 2003. But injuries took a toll on Doss's career but that does not make him a "bust" from Ohio State.
DC and Opie, before you label someone a bust, do the research on that players history.
Your both wrong about Doss being a bust ...why the bias?...only you can answer that.
FOOTBALL IS NOT BASEBALL
Home of the Free, Because of the Brave...
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,399
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,399 |
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...Just for the record...in Doss's first year with the Colts, only one DB/Safety named to the All Pro team in 2003 had more tackles than Doss (75) and that was Rodney Harrison, NE, with 94.
For the record, I admitted he had good years in his first and third seasons...
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There are a lot of NFL players who are plagued by injury and have their careers shortened due to injury. IMO, that does not make a player a bust.
Also for the record, I stated quite clearly that I didn't think injury was a reason to label a guy a bust and said that I was unfamiliar with his injury history and that I would recant my opinion if injury was a leading reason for his loss of production or short career.
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Your both wrong about Doss being a bust ...why the bias?...only you can answer that.
I showed no bias, I qualified my post based on information I didn't have. You have provided that information. Thank you.
yebat' Putin
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Joined: Mar 2007
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All Pro
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All Pro
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Posts: 512 |
Quote:
I have twenty-one players on the list, all on one side of the ball. Those stats are a little more thorough than your argument.
Note I said "right off the top of my head" meaning it was a quick response without doing a bunch of digging.
I don't agree with you that the 21 people you listed were busts, some where but not all. JMO
Did an OSU guy steal your girlfriend or something? 
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Hall of Famer
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Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 3,480 |
Quote:
Those stats are a little more thorough than your argument.
Do some research, then come talk to me.
Right, the point is that your stats have arbitrary classifications of players as a bust or not a bust....and the general consensus of everybody here is that those classifications are complete junk...thus, it doesn't really matter how many statistics you amass, because they are based on bunk.
I think that's the point people are trying to get across to you.
I'll add in that labeling Katzenmoyer a bust is ridiculous, since he suffered a career ending injury halfway through his rookie year, that can happen to anybody.
~Lyuokdea
~Lyuokdea
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