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True !....The worst part of all this is that it only confirms that ALL we have on this team is Lebron and that us making the Finals last year was a fluke....IMHO without Lebron the Cavs are a sub :500 team who would Not even sniff the NBA Playoffs....Unless Drastic changes are made I predict that Lebron is gone as soon as his contract is up....That is Sad  ....It won't matter that he is a Home Town Guy....Plain and simple , a player of his Talent Deserves to win an NBA Title....He will continue to try and do so , but IF he does win one , it won't be in Cleveland.....
The Mammal
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there was no sense of urgency tonight... or today, rather
the turnovers, the dumb shots, not dominating on the boards like we should have...
in game 4, we came out with unbelievable intensity...
i still think we win this series, but we're in for a dogfight now...
also, i liked the final call on lebron taking it to the hole, there was contact, but not enough, he just didn't get the favorable bounce...
i'll give credit to washington, although i didn't think they were all that impressive either...
i don't know what else to say about this game, other then we blew it...
i don't mind mike brown's philosophy of chewing up clock with a lead like that in games, but we need more ball movement, so that it's not so obvious we're going to throw up a 3...
and i don't see why we don't go to z in more situations like that, at the very least, he draws a double team, and someone gets a wide open look
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True !....The worst part of all this is that it only confirms that ALL we have on this team is Lebron and that us making the Finals last year was a fluke....IMHO without Lebron the Cavs are a sub :500 team who would Not even sniff the NBA Playoffs....Unless Drastic changes are made I predict that Lebron is gone as soon as his contract is up....That is Sad ....It won't matter that he is a Home Town Guy....Plain and simple , a player of his Talent Deserves to win an NBA Title....He will continue to try and do so , but IF he does win one , it won't be in Cleveland.....
i love how the minute the cavs lose a game, someone has to drop a "OMGZ LEBRON IZ GONNA LEAVE!@!@!" reference...
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Quote:
love how the minute the cavs lose a game, someone has to drop a "OMGZ LEBRON IZ GONNA LEAVE!@!@!" reference...
Isnt it ridiculous? We lost a tough hard fought playoff game, it happens, We had a good chance to win it in the end but the shot didnt fall and to say Bron didnt have any help is silly to. What did Z end up with 19 or 20?? Were any plays bigger than his two blocks in the 4th?
If the refs had called Butlers hop skip and a jump on his go ahead basket and the series is over.
KING
You may be in the drivers seat but God is holding the map. #GMSTRONG
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What sucks is I had to work tonight and had to listen to it on a crap radio that faded in and out and buzzed,,grrr. :9
Damn, sounded like we were playing volleyball there on the boards. I didn't hear the end b/c I was on the phone with a customer,,just that we lost.
Ohh well, not worried b/c I think LBJ will feed off the hate their fans have for him and will rise up! Plus, Game 7 is home. No way we lose that!
Our honor defend, we will fight to the end, for OHIO! GO BUCKS!
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Lebron is only going to put up with his lack of help for so long IMHO....He wants to succeed and win a NBA Title....He won't wait around forever for the Cavs to step up and surround him with Talent capable of winning that NBA Title....That was the point I was making....Having to step up yourself or lose will get old Really quick....
The Mammal
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You do realize that LeBron was in favor of the moves made, right? You do realize that LeBron lobbied for Z to stay, right? You do realize that Jordan had a much lesser amount of talent around him and never got tired and left, right? Wow, some posts just make you wonder if people just read the scores and form their opinions on that.
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Yes I realize you.... , I never said that Lebron was Not in favor of the trades made....I never said anything negative about Z....I would argue that Jordan with Pippen , Paxton , and the rest were more talented then our current roster....Finally yes , in the end ALL that matters is the final score , everything else falls to the wayside when you fail to win games/series which you should clearly win....We probably will win this series against the Wizards , but it as usual will take Lebron stepping up to do it....Bottom line , I am a Frustrated Fan who would like nothing more than to see us win an NBA Title....I just don't think ALL the pieces are in place yet for us to do so....** My comments on Lebron eventually leaving are based on my opinion that he will only wait so long for us to acquire those extra pieces....Lebron , The Best Player In The NBA wants and deserves to win a NBA Title.....Loyalty to the hometown is Not enough for him to pass up a legimate chance to win a NBA Title elsewhere.....JMHO....
The Mammal
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LeBron chooses to step up and be the captain. Did you notice who was guarding Butler on his final shot and then who took the final shot for us? LeBron likes the role he is in and he thrives in it.
The only piece of the puzzle we still need on this team is a solid pass first, defensive minded PG.
“It doesn't make sense to hire smart people and tell them what to do; we hire smart people so they can tell us what to do.” -Steve Jobs.
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and not to mention it took Jordan 6 years to win his first title, after 4 yrs in college. LBJ is still a pup.
Crowded elevators smell different to short people...
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The key difference between now and then is now, ever since LeBron came into the league, there's been the "countdown til LeBron leaves Cleveland" from the media.
I was too young to remember, but I don't think there was such a deal with Jordan, considering he already played in a big market.
It just bugs the hell out of me that Rome always has to bring it up...even when he doesn't get the answer he's looking for he always has to stir the pot.
Last edited by Ammo; 05/01/08 10:29 AM.
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I get ya, but I seem to hear it a lot more from the fans (seemingly after every single loss) then the media. And every time I hear it, I get the feeling that many Cleveland sports fans secretly want bad things like that to happen just so they can spout off "Whoa is me", "We're cursed"... blah blah blah.
Crowded elevators smell different to short people...
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Plus in two years we are set. Cavs will buy a great player and LBJ knows that.
Plus we are going to win the next game and then sweep the hawks.
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Yes I realize you.... , I never said that Lebron was Not in favor of the trades made....I never said anything negative about Z....I would argue that Jordan with Pippen , Paxton , and the rest were more talented then our current roster....Finally yes , in the end ALL that matters is the final score , everything else falls to the wayside when you fail to win games/series which you should clearly win....We probably will win this series against the Wizards , but it as usual will take Lebron stepping up to do it....Bottom line , I am a Frustrated Fan who would like nothing more than to see us win an NBA Title....I just don't think ALL the pieces are in place yet for us to do so....** My comments on Lebron eventually leaving are based on my opinion that he will only wait so long for us to acquire those extra pieces....Lebron , The Best Player In The NBA wants and deserves to win a NBA Title.....Loyalty to the hometown is Not enough for him to pass up a legimate chance to win a NBA Title elsewhere.....JMHO....
you do realize how great of shape the cavs are in for the future right?
32m in expiring deals next year... danny ferry will have a plethora of options that he can use... possible guys on the trading block? michael redd, t-mac...
and should there not be a quality player available, those contracts expire and the cavs have all kinds of money for FA
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True !....However , Championship Teams don't rely on 1 player , No Matter How Talented He Is....and having to do most of the time gets old Quickly.....
The Mammal
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Yes I do realize that and hope Mr. Ferry spends it Wisely.....
The Mammal
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So given that why keep spouting the LBJ will leave stuff? I highly highly doubt he will ever. Dude is from Akron and proud of it (plus like he'd EVER get a good price on that mansion.)
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I understand that Lebron is a Hometown Guy and probably wouldn't leave Cleveland....However I Really Hope that we get it right  ....I would a shame IF we don't find a way to acquire those players , whoever they may be to make legimate runs toward winning an NBA Title.....The 32M that we are going to gain should give us a chance to make an impact.... **Personally I don't believe that we will win an NBA Title until we add that 2nd Stud player(You Pick The Player) like a Pippen etc....that make a franchise into a Dynasty....
The Mammal
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I don't want to get into the LeBron stays or goes thing. Plenty of time for that.
I do wanna say this:
---The Cavs played like they could turn it up whenever they wanted. There was no sense of urgency.
---They did turn it up and took what should have been a commanding lead.
---However, they blew it at the end. I largely blame LeBron. That three he threw up when we had command was stupid. He didn't even try to look for an open man or penetrate. He dribbled and then chucked it up. That was the turning point. I love LeBron's game, but he needs to develop an killer instinct and a better understanding of what to do when you have the lead at the end of a game. He gets too complacent, and as a result, so does the team.
---I ain't bad-mouthing LeBron too bad. I ain't trying to imply anything, other than that he works on that part of his game. And..........it's all about mind-set. He needs to improve in this area to take the next step on his quest for greatness.
"What lies behind us and what lies before us are small matters compared to what lies within us."
--Ralph Waldo Emerson
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True !....This is why I feel Lebron needs an Stud to take some of the constant pressure off....It is also true that Lebron must learn how to close out tight games.....
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Quote:
I don't want to get into the LeBron stays or goes thing. Plenty of time for that.
I do wanna say this:
---The Cavs played like they could turn it up whenever they wanted. There was no sense of urgency.
---They did turn it up and took what should have been a commanding lead.
---However, they blew it at the end. I largely blame LeBron. That three he threw up when we had command was stupid. He didn't even try to look for an open man or penetrate. He dribbled and then chucked it up. That was the turning point. I love LeBron's game, but he needs to develop an killer instinct and a better understanding of what to do when you have the lead at the end of a game. He gets too complacent, and as a result, so does the team.
---I ain't bad-mouthing LeBron too bad. I ain't trying to imply anything, other than that he works on that part of his game. And..........it's all about mind-set. He needs to improve in this area to take the next step on his quest for greatness.
i could not agree with you more man...
that game has to be blamed squarely on the shoulders of lebron and mike brown...
this is a talented team, we actually have guys who can knock down open looks, and yet at the end of the game, we went to our old selves...
has anyone else noticed that since this trade, and especially over the past month or so, this team has done less and less of the lebron & 4 offense?
yet, they resorted to it with a semi-comfortable lead and a minute and change to play? why?
and also, my comment wasn't about whether or not lebron is going to leave, as much as it is, that it is really stupid to bring it up because we lost a game...
can lebron leave? sure, it can happen, we've seen it before..
but is that a certainty? i don't think it is... i think lebron would stay if this team continued to progress and get better...
which it has, this team has not taken steps back, despite what many have thought, and financially, this team has made mistakes, but there is a very bright future ahead...
honestly, with the way wally doesn't fit in with him, the cavs could package he, eric snow, and damon jones, and take any player who wanted out of their situation and move up to elite status, with your san antonios, your lakers, etc...
right now we're just a good team capable of beating anybody... but if the cavs were to add a michael redd, a tracy mcgrady, someone like that, they become a team expected to beat most...
the whole argument about whether lebron leaves or stays is dumb...
especially after a loss, it's so cleveland-esque it's not even funny...
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Not gonna get into any blame game here. We are having a lot of the same issues we have had all season, thus I won't waste anyone's time on analysis why we lost last nite. Just wanted to point this out though....
Here are the COMBINED numbers for AV, Ben, and Joe Smith last nite:
61 minutes, 2/13 fgs, 2/6 fts, 13 boards, 6 pts.
Last edited by playoffmaker; 05/01/08 10:33 PM.
I heart winning
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AV's been my biggest disappointment this year. I think the contract fued last summer unhinged him or something. Last year at this time, he was among the "don't touch" list when talking about guys on the Cavs you wouldn't want to trade, unless it was for somebody like Garnett. He looked a lot like a young Ben Wallace, and was a guy that was in there during crunch minutes of games. Now, he just seems like a liability. He's not getting as many charging calls as he used to, and his defense seems to be worse this year. Everytime he takes a dribble and moves towards the basket, you hold your breath. Last year I would of said he was the center of our future ... now I fully expect him to get moved in a trade before this time next year.
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True !....However , Championship Teams don't rely on 1 player , No Matter How Talented He Is....and having to do most of the time gets old Quickly.....
My point was that LeBron wants the team to rely on him and he likes it that way. Even if Arenas or McGrady came here LeBron would still want that role on the team.
Everyone saying that LeBron is going to leave because of his supporting cast is crap. IF, god forbid, Lebron does decide to play elsewhere, it will be because of his own reasons. not because CLE didn't surround him with talent. LeBron has had a major say in every move we have made.
“It doesn't make sense to hire smart people and tell them what to do; we hire smart people so they can tell us what to do.” -Steve Jobs.
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I agree Excl, AV has been terrible this season. I would not be surprised to see his name thrown out there as trade bait this offseason.
Does anyone know idf Sasha is due back anytime soon? Or is he done for the season?
“It doesn't make sense to hire smart people and tell them what to do; we hire smart people so they can tell us what to do.” -Steve Jobs.
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Cavs need to end this tonight. If it goes back to Cleveland, anything can happen and I get a feeling that the Wiz, and I use that in it's urinary form, will be a little too confident.
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Bottom line for the Cavs to win(any)series.....is to TAKE BALL TO THE HOLE!!!!!!!OUIT SHOOTING JUMPERS(we're not good at that  )that leads to easy and fastbreak buckets for the Wiz.......sit sorry Wally down and let Damon Jones get some PT........AND QUIT GIVING UP 2 or MORE REBOUNDS ON A SINGLE POSSESSION.......FOR JOHN MORTON  SAKE'S.......MAKE YOUR "FREE THROWS!!!!!!" botom line.......
![[Linked Image from i73.photobucket.com]](http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i209/JC21721/sig_40.jpg) "What's up? All you Haters!"
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WALLY WORLD IS HOT TO START THE GAME!!
Do you think they could get a camera a little farther from the action??
KING
You may be in the drivers seat but God is holding the map. #GMSTRONG
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WALLY WORLD IS HOT TO START THE GAME!!
Wally! He should've had a And 1 on that runner at the top of the key. 
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Can we please get rid of Varejao? He has done absolutely NOTHING this year. All the guy does is turn the ball over and miss shots. I'm tired of it.
31-23 Cavs choking again down 8.
Cleveland Browns, Space Browns ![[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]](https://i.imgur.com/iVP5Po2.png)
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31-23 Cavs choking again down 8.
Choking again?? When did they choke the first time?
KING
You may be in the drivers seat but God is holding the map. #GMSTRONG
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When they lost a 87-81 lead with 1:30 left in game 5.
Cleveland Browns, Space Browns
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Do you think they could get a camera a little farther from the action??
I'm not sure what's worse, the camera work or this broad doing the color commentary.
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When they lost a 87-81 lead with 1:30 left in game 5.
I see, the Cavs were down by 4 at the quarters end so they must be choking AGAIN , I see how you came up with that brilliant observation.
KING
You may be in the drivers seat but God is holding the map. #GMSTRONG
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They were down by 8 when I made the post. If the Cavs aren't winning, I'm not satisfied, therefore they are choking because they SHOULD be winning.
Cleveland Browns, Space Browns
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They were down by 8 when I made the post. If the Cavs aren't winning, I'm not satisfied, therefore they are choking because they SHOULD be winning.
if that's what you think, that's fine
but that isn't choking...
i don't even call what happened the other night choking, i call it stupid...
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Okay so maybe it wasn't choking but it definitely was stupid. We just didn't finish. My words were a bit harsh, i've been in pessimist mode since we lost game 5. Anyways, good run here by the Cavs, LeBron and Gibson hit two big threes! 43-41 good guys 
Cleveland Browns, Space Browns
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They were down by 8 when I made the post. If the Cavs aren't winning, I'm not satisfied, therefore they are choking because they SHOULD be winning.
Right you post they are down by 8 and by time you can even get the post up they had cut it to 4. SO maybe you should see how it plays out before you start to bash them.
Oh yeah they just went up on a boobie three, so I guess now the Wizards are choking
You may be in the drivers seat but God is holding the map. #GMSTRONG
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so I guess now the Wizards are choking
Yep. 
Where is a DeShaun Stevenson voodoo doll when you need one? 
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13 to 0 run by the Cavs!! Boobie is feeling it now!
KING
HA HA joe smith make that 15 to 0!!
You may be in the drivers seat but God is holding the map. #GMSTRONG
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Forums DawgTalk Tailgate Forum ***Cavs/Wizards*** Playoff Thread
-Part 2-
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