DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum 2008 Core Players

The difference between one year wonders and perennial contenders is the way an organization builds the team. There are certain core members of your team that stay from year to year, and that allows improvements and consistency. In 2002, Butch ripped apart the team after the playoff year, and they fell apart. Will it happen this year? I say no, and these are the core player grades going into 2008. There are some players who are under contract that I don't mention - this is because I'm not counting on them making the team, or because they won't make the team if we can find a decent upgrade.

The O (B+)

QB – Anderson, Quinn, Dorsey (B)
Most likely there will be no change here. Anderson will sign long term or high tender. We’re better off this way anyway, considering how many starting QBs get injured. Anderson is good, has room to improve, and the team likes him. Quinn will be good, there is little doubt about that. He will get his chance. A trade will happen if it’s too good to pass up, but it’s best for the team to just leave it alone this year and create more stability and continuity. By 2009, only two of the three will be here.

RB – Lewis, Wright, Harrison (B)
We will resign Lewis. His familiarity with our system, the O line, his FB, and his leadership make him more valuable to us than anyone else. His production with this O and his enjoyment of this team make us more valuable to him than anyone else. Barring an offer from someone like the Pats, Lewis starts for us next year. Wright has maxed out his talent and will be eventually upgraded, but it must be someone who excels at ST like he does as well. Harrison will get more touches. If he continues to improve his blocking, blitz pick up, and ST contributions, he will overtake Wright because he is more talented. By 2009, only two of the three will be here.

FB – Vickers, Ali (A)
Surprising Ali made the team and stayed active all year. There will be no change. Vickers almost made the pro-bowl, and has way exceeded expectations. Ali is a good STer and viable back up. No change for years to come.

TE – Winslow, Heiden, Dinkins (B)
Winslow, the 2nd most irreplaceable guy on offense (Joe T is first) has been really great, but unfortunately he’s unlikely to be the complete TE he once was because he’s lost some blocking power from the knee injury. He’s mainly a receiver for us, but he can block decently, despite what a lot of people think. He’s just simply a positional blocker instead of being able to knock people off the line like Dinkins can. Heiden is a great team guy, good ST and can start in a pinch. He is not, however, a true 2nd TE threat. Not sure when his contract is up, but he’s likely with us for only a few more years. No change this year though, unless some great prospect unseats Dinkins.

WR – Edwards, Jurevicius, Cribbs, Wilson (C)
Wilson will play next year. He’s a receiver and it’s year 3 – traditionally the year he’s expected to produce. He’s talented. Why he hasn’t performed or been in games is really pure speculation on all our parts. Whatever the reason, he wasn’t the best choice. If he was a truly a flop, however, he wouldn’t have stayed on the team as a back up in case of injury. I have been wrong before, but I’m betting he is still considered Joe J’s replacement for 2009-10. Cribbs will continue to get more touches, particularly if teams keep kicking away from him on ST. We could use someone else, no doubt, and there could be mid rounder or vet FA get added. Edwards and Jurevicius will continue where they left off.

OT – Thomas, Shaffer, Tucker, Sowells, Steinbach (A)
This group is interesting. Thomas and Shaffer stay the starters, and Tucker is great as RG. What unknown is how an injury would shape things. If Thomas goes down, god forbid, likely Shaffer slips over and tuck goes to RT and sowells goes to RG. Or Sowells goes to RT and tuck stays put. Or Steinbach goes to LT and Bentley (if he’s back) goes to LG. There is a lot of versatility, but the spots they are in now are truly their best spots, so who knows what the depth really is. We need to continue to draft and develop here, particularly at LT, because there really isn’t a bonafide back up for Joe. Back up LT is like back up QB. Despite the fact that he might never play, you need someone good. Dorsey is an UFA and likely gone.

OG – Tucker, Steinbach, Sowells, Bentley, Fraley (A)
Why no McKinney or Friedman? They’re UFA and I’m not counting on a return, especially if Bentley comes back. That’s a big if, however. The perfect scenario, of course, is to ease Bentley back behind Tucker and Fraley – two guys who are doing great but would be replaced if Bentley retains old form. Fraley can do guard spots too. Amazingly, this may well be the best position, combining talent and depth, on the whole team. That gives me goose bumps. Sowells will replace tucker eventually, and can also play RT.

C – Fraley, Bentley (B)
I’m really hoping Bentley comes back, as you can see. If he doesn’t, we re-sign a vet. Either way, drafting a developmental Center is a good idea.

In a perfect world, the O line in 2009 is this: Thomas, Steinbach, Bentley, Sowells, Shaffer. That’s a group that is under contract, young enough, and could develop scary continuity and consistency. Even Spergon Wynn and James Jackson could do well with that in front. For those counting at home, that’s 22 offensive core players going in to next year. Sprinkle in another WR and OL or two, and that’s your 2008 offense. With Chud year II, you really can’t ask for too much more than that. Offense will be good.


The D (C-)

CB – Bodden, E. Wright, McDonald, Holly (B)
Will Bodden rebound from his various injuries to be the shut down we thought he was? Will Wright continue his development or face a sophomore slump? McDonald? Has Holly maxed out his potential? It is, no doubt, a talented group of guys, but there is almost too much youth and not enough vet presence to keep them focused. K Wright was little more than mediocre this year. Maybe Nick Sorenson? Loved him on ST. These guys were real up and down – was it a matter of Grantham/Crennel/Tucker disagreements? This group must, MUST, take a step forward and realize their potential. Look to see maybe a vet added, but this is your group for the foreseeable future.

S – Jones, Pool (D)
And that’s it. Russell is gone so I won’t lament the point. A guy I was hoping would still be here is Justin Hamilton. I still don’t really understand what happened with his injury release, but I liked his athleticism and thought he was developing pretty well. Jones and Pool are starting to finally get it after a tough year of learning, particularly for Pool. I’m not comfortable just yet with them, but they’re you’re starters. Depth? Nothing. Adams was so-so, don’t even know if he’s coming back. We need to take a serious look in both FA and draft for safety help, because an injury to Jones and we’re in deep trouble. Baxter, bless him, is gone, and a long shot to come back.

OLB – Wimbley, McGinnest, Peek (C)
After all the ups and downs through the years, I’d love to see Thompson back. He’s made himself a very versatile LB and good STer. But he’s an FA and may not be back, and we’ll need someone else. Stewart? Don’t know where he is with injury and contract, much less talent. McGinnest has another part time year in him, but that’s probably it. Peek is good, just was hurt this year. McMillan never realized his potential. So we need at least 1, maybe two guys. Terrell Suggs anyone?

ILB – Jackson, Davis, Williams (B)
Again, Thompson would be nice, knowledgeable depth to have here. We’ll see. Davis, oft criticized, is what he is: A smart leader who is small step slow. This was beautifully demonstrated in the Buffalo game, when the driving snow took speed out of the game. Davis was everywhere in that game. He’s got the contract, he’s solid, he’s staying. Jackson continues to develop, don’t worry about his size (see Bob Sanders). Williams is good, needs to keep becoming more consistent and he’ll eventually replace Davis. We need one to two more guys as depth and ST players.

NT – S. Smith, Kelley (C)
Ethan Kelley is an UFA who I expect to be resigned. He’s done a decent job, and we need the depth if nothing else. We will likely sign or draft someone else as well, particularly if Smith moves to end permanently, which I personally think would be a mistake. Obviously, if Kelley isn’t resigned, we need someone else. If these are the two we’ve got, it’s not that bad as long as the end play improves.

DE – R. Smith, Purcell (F)
I’m not counting Fraser or Roye because Roye is probably done and Fraser just lacks the power, bless his effort. He belongs in a 4-3. This is, hands down, the weakest part of the team. Savage knows it, Crennel knows it, you know it, I know it, Ben Gay knows it. Smith is fine for a 2 down tackle, but he shouldn't be the best guy on the team. We need major upgrade, in FA and the draft. Purcell is really nothing right now, but he’s on here by default because we probably can’t find enough better players to keep him off. He has "potential." Our first day draft choice needs to be on the D line, and our big FA spending needs to be on the D line. Just like with the O line, if you fix it, all the other talent on your team is more likely to flourish. If we upgrade here properly, it is possible to see the defense make a jump of the magnitude the offense did this year.

That’s 16 core guys, way short of what we need. Which is fine, because that’s where Savage is focused. If we can have 2 big FA signings, 2 day one picks, and 1 guy step up out of the many late round picks and developmental guys we have, that’s five more core players and we’re off and running. Besides poor performance, part of the reason why now is a good time to see Grantham off is because Tucker can now have input on the new guys he wants. Next year will be improved, but still developing. 2009 will be our first real solid defensive season, and you know what they say wins championships.


The ST. (A)

Kicker – Dawson, Zastudil (hold), Pontbriand (snap). (A)
Dear everyone who can’t stop criticizing Dawson: shut up already. He’s very accurate in bad weather and under 50 yards. VERY accurate. He does not have the leg to make 55 and 60 yarders. That’s okay, it’s what he is. He’s still one of the best in the business, and since we play in a windy and cold stadium, and not a dome, we’re better off with him than someone who can make 60 yarders and get consistent touchbacks. He had a career year and was even selected as All pro by a couple of AP writers.

Punter – Zastudil, Pontbriand (snap). (B)
I’d love to say he’s an “A,” but whether because of his injury or what, Z wasn’t as great this year as we’d all hoped. He was good, definitely, but let’s face it, Scott Player may have been better. On moustache alone. However, I fully expect Z to be perfect next year, improve his inside the 20 kicks, and eliminate the shank or two he had this year. Since I didn’t mention it above, all hail Pontbriand, of course, the best Butch pick of all time.

Returner – Cribbs (A+)
I’m in love with Joshua Cribbs. There, I said it.

So we were worried about losing our ST coach. So much for that. That’s another 4 core groupers. Which brings the grand total to 42. That, my friends, is what you call continuity. 42 members of the 2007 football team, a team that won 10 games (easy schedule or not), retruning for 2008. And we WANT them returning. That is how you build a football team, a playoff caliber football team year in and year out. No more starting over. Whether Crennel leaves in a year or in ten, this kind of core group of players, supplemented each year with good drafting and wise FA spending, keeps your team competitive.

Overall Team Grade for 2008: (B-).

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Returner – Cribbs (A+)
I’m in love with Joshua Cribbs. There, I said it.

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Knowing he is handling the K/O returns and P/R does give a person that warm fuzzy feeling.

Myself, I get a warm fuzzy feeling watching him as a gunner. I honestly think that is one of his best attributes....putting it out there and leaving it on the field as gunner isn't something we have seen in a long time. One of the best in the business jmo.

Cribbs just refuses to be blocked. I watched him on one punt in I believe it was the SF game. He had TWO guys on him, and he just battled his way through them and made the tackle.

He is a big guy, but he's very fast and athletic. I think he's deceivingly fast to a lot of those guys.

When I watch other teams play, their return guys on kicks will get to the 20 or 25, and I feel like "wow, what a loser", where in the past, we would have been happy to have that. Now, if Cribbs doesn't get to the 35 or better, I feel cheated.

LOL, I know what you mean. I get so excited watching him, just to see how far he can run before they catch him.

Where is Jason Wright?

Harrison doesn’t even dress….

Travis Wilson has not shown that he is talented. I think he will be upgraded upon in free agency and will be our 4th.

That's a huge project you've undertaken,and it seems to be well researched.As with any project this size,there canbe many many points to be debated.Rather than nit-pick your work,I'll just say I wish I had you grading my papers way back when.With a sense of accomplishment,I might have applied myself more,instead of trying to be the class clown.

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In a perfect world, the O line in 2009 is this: Thomas, Steinbach, Bentley, Sowells, Shaffer. That’s a group that is under contract, young enough, and could develop scary continuity and consistency.

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I guess my perfect world keeps Fraley and moves Bentley to guard. He's only 28.

So it would be: Thomas, Steiner, Fraley, Bentley and Schaffer.

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I guess my perfect world keeps Fraley and moves Bentley to guard. He's only 28.

So it would be: Thomas, Steiner, Fraley, Bentley and Schaffer.

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I second that.

However, as my buddy told me maybe a week after LeCharles went down with injury, I doubt if LeCharles Bentley ever suits up for the Cleveland Browns.

Hence, we'll probably end up with Tucker again as our RG and continue to develop Sowells.

How is the draft this year for guards?

It doesn't matter Canada. I don't want a draft spot used on a guard this year. Unless he's an absolute steal in the later rounds.

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It doesn't matter Canada. I don't want a draft spot used on a guard this year. Unless he's an absolute steal in the later rounds.

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Hey, its definitely not first on my shopping list, but its still something to be considered.

McKinney hasn;t been resigned and I dunno if he'll re-sign as a backup. Odds are someone else will grab him as a starter. That leaves Friedman (who I think is decent) and Sowells (who apparently has promise but can;t seem to get on the field). Do we still have Matua as well?

I'd guess that we pick up an O-Line guy, probably a guard, at some point in the draft. Maybe as high as the 4th. After all, we've seen what happens when we don;t have an ongoing commitment to O-Line.

I agree. I don't think drafting a guard would be a bad thing at all.

We have made some good strides to upgrade the line. Now the way to maintain that is to not neglect it with a few 7th round picks every now and then.

It wouldn't bother me if we selected a O-lineman in one of the first 4 rounds forever....same with D-line(front 7). Those are a teams biggest units.....it only makes sense to keep a infusion of talent.

You have to figure every one of the picks isn't going to pan out.

Absolutely... obviously Dline is a priority this draft, but we can;t blind ourselves to keep our other positions healthy or even upgrading....

That being said, I'm not immersed in draft research quite yet so I'm not sure of where the prospects are. I know that in the college football I watched this year, there was no one that really stood out to me.

Lucky for us, Savage doesn't seem to have tunnel vision and doesn't focus solely on needs when drafting.....he keeps a good balance of who the better players are and will make that selection despite what might be perceived as a need.