DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk 2025 NFL Draft DRAFT II

Do we (need to get a fQB)?

Please correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't this last SB kinda argue against the assumption that a fQB is required to win?

Given that DTR isn't gonna make it and Watson isn't going to make it and Winston is looking for a new job elsewhere,,, YEAH,,, we are gonna need a QB

Jalen Hurts have a decent stat line in the Superbowl, and he had a decent year as well. NOT spellbinding,, But decent.

We haven't had anyone do things that well since Flacco or maybe Mayfield.

So yeah, I would think we need one.

Hurts total QBR for 2024 had him ranked 10th. I think what someone considers a franchise QB is quite subjective and differs from person to person. I believe that many and maybe even most people would consider Hurts a franchise QB. The Eagles felt so strongly that he is a franchise QB they gave him a five year contract extension.

It is true that they were fortunate enough to draft him in the second round. Just like Green Bay drafted Aaron Rodgers at #24. But I suppose we can dwell on the exception to the rule and pray that exception works for the Browns if we so choose to.

Just Clicking:

https://www.nbc4i.com/sports/sports...compares-potential-target-to-c-j-stroud/

Brian Hoyer says he thinks Dart is another CJ Stroud



A former Cleveland Browns quarterback has compared a potential target for the team to C.J. Stroud.
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The Cleveland Browns have been connected to quite a few potential quarterback options already this offseason. Perhaps the most intriguing option comes in the form of Ole Miss signal caller Jaxson Dart.

Dart would not be a target for the Browns with the No. 2 overall pick in the 2025 NFL Draft. Cleveland could either trade down for him or try to trade back up for him later in the first round.

However, the upside of Dart is through the roof and there are many who think that he has superstar potential at the NFL level.

One of those people is former Browns quarterback Brian Hoyer. During a recent appearance on 92.3 The Fan, Hoyer offered an intriguing potential comparison for Dart.

Hoyer made a comparison between Dart and current Houston Texans star quarterback C.J. Stroud.

“If I’m going to compare one QB in this draft to C.J. Stroud, it would probably be Jaxson Dart. The more I’ve started to watch the film on him, he wants to play from the pocket,” he said.

Passing on Shedeur Sanders or Cam Ward and instead bringing Dart in would be a heavily criticized move. If they ended up being right on it, Andrew Berry would look like a genius.

During the 2024 college football season with Ole Miss, Dart ended up completing 69.3 percent of his pass attempts for 4,279 yards, 29 touchdowns, and six interceptions. He also flashed his dual-threat ability with 495 yards and three touchdowns on the ground.

There is a very real chance that Dart could end up being the long-term franchise quarterback in Cleveland.

Even though he has not received the same kind of hype that Sanders and Ward have, Dart is an extremely talented player. Hoyer's opinion of him shows a bit of that potential.

All of that being said, it will be interesting to see what the Browns choose to do in the 2025 NFL Draft and who they bring in to be their new starting quarterback. Dart would not be a bad choice at all.

This article was originally published on www.si.com/nfl/browns/ as Former Browns QB Compares Potential Target to C.J. Stroud.




I got no idea if he's right.. Just another opinion I guess.

My bet is that Dart goes top ten

Bone, Pit, and Daman,

I'm just saying that we just saw the team that built up everyone around a solid-if-unspectacular QB soundly trounce the team with the generational QB talent. I took this last SB as the best argument against the "fQB or bust" narrative.


Put another way, I think we're MUCH closer to becoming the next Eagles team than we are becoming the next Chiefs.

The more I watch these QBs the more I think it is silly season draft posturing pushing guys up to increase trade offers and push down good players at other positions than any of them actually being good. Maybe some of the warts can be treated, but they are some pretty major cases. I'm not sure any of them are week 1 or even year 1 ready.

Unfortunately, I think taking any of the QBs and expecting them to play right away results in losing and the belief that there is no future QB. The more I look for something to believe in, the more instances of what in the world was he thinking I find. Shedeur is probably the most NFL "ready," and his pocket presence and avoiding negative plays are atrocious. Random underhand, sideways chucks under pressure had me shuddering remembering Weeden.

Dart at the bottom of the 3rd? Sure.

Dart at 33? There are probably options I like better, but maybe. QB thirst is real. Pittsburgh wants to take him at 21, have at it. Push down a more NFL ready impact player.

Dart anywhere in round 1? I can't get there. His decision making wasn't especially strong and the decisions get harder at the next level, windows smaller, more complex defenses. I have a hard time with QBs in that system. I thought Matt Corral had a chance to be good. I'd argue he was a better decision maker and faster through progressions.

I think "needing" a QB that season was a factor in the Watson decision. Can't talk yourself into guys just because you need one.

Can't pigeon hole yourself into having to draft something that isn't there. I'm not saying don't do anything at QB, but "relying" on any of the guys in the draft seems ill advised to me. Gamble on one later as a developmental project? Okay. Take a flier on Shough/Ewers later maybe.

I think our chances of winning next year are better if we just take players that are great elsewhere instead of trying to force a QB that quite possibly just isn't there.

Honestly, I might call up Vrabel and see what it would take to get Milton. They have a lot of needs in New England. Van Pelt likely used some language/concepts that would translate here.

5 Months ago, the Browns were seen as a team that had as deep a roster as any team in the league. Obviously, they were not as good as everyone thought. Now after a very bad season the narrative is the Browns are a terrible team. They are not as bad as a 3-win team. There is talent on this roster. Does not need a complete rebuild. Need to find a good bridge QB and either this year or next draft a young QB for the future. Rebuild the running game. This is the perfect draft to get some young RB's to pair with Chubb. Drafting a couple young OLineman to replace the aging vets is important but returning to the wide zone blocking scheme will allow Bitonio and Teller excel as they used to. That was the biggest mistake made last season.

To make any fair comparison here I think one needs to look at how Mahommes played in this game. He threw two Int's and had a fumble. The Eagles have a top 10 QB. I'm not so sure what's "unspectacular" about that. So if we can accomplish getting a top 10 QB you can certainly build a team around him to win a SB. If of course you have a capable enough of a GM in charge to accomplish that. That may be the Browns biggest hurdle.

I have no idea who thought that with the exception of Browns fans who were only fooling themselves. When you have no legitimate QB and no legitimately healthy starting RB the only people who seriously think you have are a threat are homers.

Before the season started most talking heads all said the Browns have a great roster the question mark was how would Watson play. Would he be the Watson they saw in Houston or the Watson that played most games in Cleveland. That was the narrative. Then the season started, and the team fell down. The narrative changed.

Bottom line is I don't think the team was as good as said before the season and they are not as bad as said after the season. Imagine Jamies Winston starting all 17 games. Would this team have only won 3 games. I would assume at least 8. Winston showed he could move the offense remarkable similar to the way Flacco moved the offense a year earlier.

Winston sucked. he onkly threw 1 more TD than he did Int's. I believe saying "most talking heads all said the Browns have a great roster" is a huge overstatement. When you have Jerry Jeudy as your #1 WR, no Chubb and a watson that has already shown he's only a shadow of what he once was I believe most of those who were making that claim were doing it for shock value, to get hits on their website or homer Browns reporters.

And it most certainly was not "most of them".

The only real surprise was that the defense did more poorly than people expected.

I think the trap you fell into is the sources you chose to read. As with anything else if you choose to only listen to what you want to hear it only reinforces what you already want to believe.

If the Titans are stupid enough not to draft ward at #1 their new group isn't any smarter than their old group.

Do you remember last off season? The Browns were coming off an 11-6 campaign and had the #1 defense in the NFL in 2023 and many projected them to compete for the AFC North. In August the Browns had Amari Cooper and Jerry Juedy at WR. There were expectations on the team that they did not live up to. To say lest they were a disappointment. It was obvious now they were not as good as we all thought they were before the season started all, but I guess you who knows everything. I am just saying this team now is not as bad as they seem. I agree with DTR under center they may be the worst team of all time. Winston had a 500-yard game on the road vs a playoff contender. He beat the Steelers and the Ravens. If he could cut down on the picks, he could be a great QB. If the Browns can find that veteran bridge QB to throw the ball like Flacco and Winston without the picks this team can be better than expectations. The defense with Garrett is still not bad. By the way he asked for a trade but is under contract for 2 more years the Browns do not have to trade him.

Oh I remember. I also remember Flacco was gone. I also remember that hardly anyone expected our O to do anything without Chubb and a reliable QB that we did not have.


I see that you changed it from "most" to "many" so at least we're making progress.

I certainly never mentioned Sanders. I think his name alone has him overrated and one thing we don't need is the sideshow his dad will bring along with him. Talking about a coaching nightmare.

I watched this FO focus too much on film while not putting enough focus on the situation when they signed watson. I have no patience to witness a rerun of that.

IIRC, most fans were projecting them to win the AFCN and even a shot at the SB

As the sports media were saying the Steelers / Ravens would win the division

The Bengals would be third and the Browns in the

Basement.

They were right

How do they know those things ?

Some people seem to forget that we didn't even win the division in 2023. In fact we were two full games behind the Ravens in 2023 for the division win. We barely made it as a wild card team.

Memories can play tricks on people.

I don't think we have a D like them... But I'd be very OK if you were right... I'd love it

Travis Hunter.

Can he actually do both?

But in a slightly different way. I think he'd be great for the offense, but is there a way to limit the contact on defense and play there, too?

I think he might fit better at FS than CB for us. I don't really want him in run support or playing press. Keep him away from the box. Just let him sit back and play games with QBs and ballhawk. His football IQ/awareness is ridiculous. Avoid contact and wear and tear on D. Ankle tackle as the last line of defense if absolutely necessary. He's actually harder to avoid at safety. A QB just can't look to the other side receiver. The way they protect WRs now, you almost want the safety avoiding (heavy) contact anyways. I think a back end eraser could really take the D to the next level.

I also think he's the top receiver in this draft (Tet's good, too), and offers a skill set that we don't necessarily have there as far as cerebral and making himself available to his QB against zone to go along with the crazy athleticism and ball skills.

I'm not saying he is there, but you've got Ed Reed and Justin Jefferson upside in one pick potentially.

Plus, it seems he's an A+ human and potential face of the franchise.

Edit: I don't need him in on running plays on offense. Can potentially shave off some wear and tear there, too. 3rd downs and RedZone can be his money makers.

Agreed. You need to perhaps jump in front of the Steelers (and assuming they don't trade up a bit)....

And therein lies the rub. If this FO determines he's their guy and they don't move up at the perfect time, it will be too late. The questions then become who can really predict when that right time is and who trusts them to get that right?

If you believe a QB is your future franchise QB they're worth the #2 pick. If you don't they're not.

The dots may be connecting and we don't know it. It goes both ways, he may come to the team and let them know why NOT to draft him.

If I am throwing my money on a QB in this draft, the only one I would feel comfortable putting the bet on is Jaxson Dart.. That's only if I can get him in the second round. I'm not trading down from #2 and I'm not trading up from 33. If he goes in the first round, then so be it, let the other team take the chance. If he looks like I think he will at the combine, he might end up going in the first round.. I don't have enough confidence in any of them to take a first round QB this year.

I kind of agree with you. I think the off coverage and ball skills he shows as the top CB fit more at FS with Schwartz. I'd play him there full time. Ideally, he'd (help) fix one of our bigger issues on D last year-- forcing turnovers. QBs having to find him could also give the DL an extra tick in the rush.

I'd use him 3rd downs and RedZone on offense, perhaps a bit more than 30% of the offensive snaps, but close to. Those two things were also our problem areas on offense (even when we were doing well.) Not using him in the running game could show a tendency, but could also set up tendency breakers. With no sure fire QB (and our OL), going back to more running game and playaction based offense on early downs makes sense to me.

It's sort of like he's the perfect fit for us. Of course, we'll probably pass on him for a million dollar lottery ticket at QB, or Tennessee will take it out of our hands.

I think the injury concern isn't really something you can base on playing time. Injuries can happen at the first snap. I do think you can try to focus him in roles that limit/avoid contact while still taking advantage of the best parts of his skillset.

Going a step further, do you have good reasons to believe or is your belief more hope based? Is it "we think he's going to be" or "we think he could be?"

Spending $2 dollars on a lottery ticket, why not. Spending the number two pick in the NFL Draft on a lottery ticket, please don't.

I have no reason to believe we'll be able to fix the giant, red, flashing warning lights. Can they be? Maybe. But Ward looks the best of the bunch and he plays a brand a lot like Watson. I don't think we're set up to support that style.

I don't have an opinion on any of the top rated QB's in this draft. That actually has nothing to do with what I posted whatsoever. And additionally I never put any qualifiers on it as you did. ie....."we think he's going to be" or "we think he could be?"

From a realistic standpoint that's what it boils to with every NFL QB that gets drafted. We've seen it time and time again where QB's are drafted at the top of the draft or near the top of the draft that fail in the NFL. Those teams thought they found their guy. So every QB drafted is based upon the team who drafts them thinking he will be a franchise QB anywhere near the top of the draft. There is no sure thing. I would say that Andrew Luck who was projected to be a generational QB proves that point.

You see, I don't get paid millions of dollars to make such a decision. I don't have an entire scouting staff or analytics department to help me analyze this situation. The "you" I was referring to are the Browns FO. If after the entire process they deem any of these QB's as what they see as the answer to the Browns solving the issue of a franchise QB they should draft him. Even at #2.

I was referring to the same "you"/"we," the people actually making the decision.

Got it. I just found it confusing when you responded to me and asked......


I simply felt you were asking me because they don't read the board and the answer would obviously be that after reviewing the film, after all of the scouting reports and all of the analytical data was compiled was the result of their findings concluded he was worth the investment.

Sorry about the confusion.