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Browns? Shaffer trying to live up to contract Wednesday, December 13, 2006 By Steve Doerschuk REPOSITORY SPORTS WRITER
BEREA Steve Largent, who had Hall of Fame hands, came out of the University of Tulsa. So did Bingo Smith, whose No. 7 hangs from the rafters at The Q.
The Browns need left tackle Kevin Shaffer to be the next great thing from the famed petroleum engineering school. After all, they've promised him $36 million, three times the infamous buyout received by former Tulsa Rogers High School coach Butch Davis.
Know this about the 26-year-old Shaffer: His family may never be hungry, but he is.
"I want a Pro Bowl. I want a Super Bowl," he said. "They're both very important. I want 'em both before I'm done."
He says it with conviction, knowing circumstantial evidence makes him guilty by association with a bad 2006.
The Browns are 4-9. Charlie Frye has been sacked 43 times. The rushing offense is ranked just a short swim north of the South Pole.
But give Shaffer credit for a whiff of progress, too.
In the last two games, in which Frye has played a half and Derek Anderson has been in for six quarters, the offensive line has given up one sack.
General Manager Phil Savage, who took a gamble after Shaffer started just two seasons in Atlanta, has been careful in talking about Shaffer.
n Here's Savage after six games, at which point Jeff Davidson replaced Mo Carthon as coordinator: "Kevin has actually done an adequate job. He had that holding penalty that kind of set the stage in the first game. After that, he's played pretty well overall."
n Here's Savage after 11 games, coming off a 30-0 loss to the Bengals: "Kevin Shaffer is playing left tackle right now, and based on the options we had last year, we felt like he was a good choice. There have been stretches this year where he has played pretty good football.
"For the most part, I think he's been adequate."
Sounds like a "C."
From his locker this week, Shaffer assessed his play: "I think I've progressively gotten better. I had a rocky start. Coming into a new system, I know that happens.
"For a while, I was the new guy trying to catch up. Left tackle is a tough position to do that. I feel pretty confident in the way I've been playing the last while, after the first two games.
"I feel like I'm starting to be a pretty strong player. I need to keep pushing with that."
BUTCH PASSED
Shaffer and center LeCharles Bentley became the most expensive offensive linemen in Browns history when they signed as free agents in March. Both got $36 million deals, with Bentley's spread over six years, one less than Shaffer's.
Fans embraced the Bentley signing because he has been a Pro Bowler at guard and center. They questioned Shaffer, because ... who was he?
The Browns had a crack at Shaffer in the seventh round in 2002, but Butch Davis preferred tackle Joaquin Gonzalez with the No. 227 pick. Shaffer went to the Falcons at No. 244.
Shaffer got in six games as a rookie, started eight games in his second year and was a full-time Atlanta starter in 2004 and '05.
He blocked for Michael Vick. Because Vick is a lefty who sets up opposite of righties, Shaffer was not protecting the blind side. Savage had to project how Shaffer would fare at protecting the blind sides of Cleveland's right-handed QBs.
"I didn't really have a big name," Shaffer said, "but every GM knows who every left tackle is."
'HAD NO IDEA'
Shaffer guessed low as to what he might be worth on the 2006 open market.
"All of a sudden, my agent said, 'No, Kevin, the market is huge. This is what you're gonna get.' He was pretty much right on," Shaffer said.
"I had to condition myself to start hearing those numbers. Going in as a seventh-round pick, my signing bonus was $26,500."
Shaffer maintains the view that draft status disappears once a player makes a team and becomes a starter. At 26, he takes heart in his mix of youth - he'll turn 27 in March - and growing experience.
Shaffer won't be 30 until the fifth year of his contract.
"I feel real confident about my play," Shaffer said. "I feel like, now that I've been in the system a little bit, I'm just gonna go up and ... I'll shoot for that Pro Bowl."
tradition can only carry you so far, then you have to start winning again.
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[color:"red"] Here's Savage after 11 games, coming off a 30-0 loss to the Bengals: "Kevin Shaffer is playing left tackle right now, and based on the options we had last year, we felt like he was a good choice. There have been stretches this year where he has played pretty good football.
"For the most part, I think he's been adequate." [/color] Phil knows what adequate means..if U wanted adequate U can sign anyone..or draft a rookie and have him play adequate in his first year..no? I sense disappointment and trying not to discredit him a lot. Now me as a fan and a person who watches line play..he's played less than adequate as they ALL HAVE .
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or phil had something different in mind all along. he could have brought him here to fill another position after this year.
tradition can only carry you so far, then you have to start winning again.
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Nope, I don't believe tht for one second even if he's moved to another position. Opie got him to play LT ...not for another spot . Thats way too much money to be a swing player. If that were the intent well it would have been indicated , Opie would have said he's our LT for the time being or something close to that,and I doubt if he'd got that much money.
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Know this about the 26-year-old Shaffer: Young will only get better, and when were ready to compete for playoffs and more, he will be at his prime. dont expect all -pro performances out of his yet, he's learning...
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What are you thinking Knox,,, maybe he moves over to Tucks spot at RT? or are you saying he goes to LG? Which?
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"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe." Damanshot
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When it comes to OL you are only as good as the guy next to u and he is playing next to the worst LG in the NFL and I mean worst.
I know the kid has been beaten up because he isnt a super star but I think he can do the job and do it well. Several of his sacks came from pass protection for a 7 step drop and the quarterback taking a 3 step drop.
More trouble has come from Shaffer doing exactly what he supposed to do, yet the QB doesnt step up. QB takes one step forward and it isnt a sack, but instead QB trys to go even deeper into his set or takes off a boogying and gets whacked.
Now throw in RBs that have brain farts and forget to chip and it gets even worse. Reuben does a good job at this and should not be included in the brain fart group.
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[color:"red"]"Thats way too much money to be a swing player."
[color:"orange"]I don't think so...especially when a Unit become more talented - lets just say for argument sake...we draft a stud LT or sign one in Leonard Davis - Shaffer moves to the LG position and they...they = Davis, Shaffer, Bentley...develop to be a Pro-Bowl type Unit of the left side. Shaffer no longer is described by the adjective "adequate" and now is known as good-very good...I'm not saying Pro-Bowl greatest around...just very good.
Well I have news for you...the contract is the one of discussion and by your reasoning noted above you state way too much money...possibly so - possibly he would be the best candidate for a team to restructure with when adding those one or two missing pieces to a SB. But I would like to bring to your attention. The new CBA aggreement that we signed...the Cap is going Sky High now. FA is going to grow over the next 5 years. Although that money in 05/06 standards (remember the new agreement didn't hit the streets yet or just did) cannot be imagined 3 years from now that will be considered a bargain price for a good to very good LG and more than justifiable as will Bentley's contract.
The FA market is about to hit the fan...and remember - after the signing bonus is absorbed and if he remains just adequate at LG and we got Kids developing that give us that or more projection...Shaffer simply put would be gone.
But and I'm saying "IF/BUT" Shaffer turns out to be good to very good in the unit...his contract will not be outrageous as the FA market is about to hit the fan so to speak.
JMHO
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off! Go Browns! CHRIST HAS RISEN! GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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Thanks for the post, Knox.
Our OL is a mess as much due to injury as lack of talent. Tucker and Bentley throw a huge curve ball in our off-season. While its easy to say "don't plan on them being back", that decision impacts your cap and your draft - and we still have a lot of holes to fill to be grabbing guys for positions that end up not being a need. I wouldn't want to be Savage in this case - its a no-win situation. Go convervative and you miss other things, plan for worst case and you end up with unnecessary holes in other places.
Watching film on the guy - he does struggle here and there, but rarely is the cause of a play blowing up compared to our other guys on OL. Shaffer isn't our weakest link by any stretch. In the pecking order of OL upgrades, he's pretty low - especially considering our questions around C and RT.
If we come across a stud LT - you never pass up that chance. Otherwise, I'm much more concerned about the interior line.
LT is supposed to be our best pass-blocker. Sometimes he's looked to fit the bill and others he's been just awful. RT is supposed to be our best run-blocker. I'm not sure he fits that much better than LT.
Adequate is probably about right on. The million dollar question is whether he can improve.
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[color:"orange"] U missed the intent of my reply. Knox thinks Phil 's intent was to bring him in play him at LT this year and move him next year to fill a hole. I disagree , I don't think that was ever Phil's intent..I don't stand by the notion he could never be moved, I've speculated on him going to RT, but that wasn't Phil's intention..he thought Shaffer was the best FA LT after Shelton left. THEY spent Cadillac prices on a Impala..and didn't intend to dress it up like one.. Even if the Browns had a real left tackle and Shaffer proved better on the right side, that's a whole lotta money for a rt who isn't exactly a road grader. [/color]
Last edited by Attack Dawg; 12/13/06 12:27 PM.
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[color:"orange"] Even if the Browns had a real left tackle and Shaffer proved better on the right side, that's a whole lotta money for a rt who isn't exactly a road grader. [/color] Nothing new, but the only comment I'd throw out there is that our options were pretty limited at LT. You generally pay more when supply is low - for whatever its worth.
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[color:"orange"]No I didn't miss your intent.
Possibly not as soon as next year - but if we get the stud LT I covet he of course must move...but lets say we take a 2nd-3rd rounder - I can see Shaffer playing LT another season.
So as for Savages intent. I think it was for him to play LT until the "Opportunity" arises to get a stud LT - which can or might not happen its a rare opportunity.
So to define Savages intent I think there is no boundary on time for the intent.
But in your post you define that intent to be LT and only LT due to money.
But this is not baseball. the contract can be redone, restructured or terminated. But my point is the value of contracts is going to change dramatically over the next 5 years. so that in 05 thinking what you say is correct. That contract means LT and only LT. What I'm suggesting is that in 08 (when he might got to LG) the money he will be getting will not be considered off the wall high for a good LG.
All we know is that Savage considers him "adequate" which means many things but none depicting him as the "one". It all will depend on opportunity. But because of the size of contract I don't think that spells one way or another backing Savage to the wall cause of the increase in Cap Money and the size of contracts in general. It will be on the high end...but not LT money only anymore. And remember adequate at LG for that money will mean Not For Long...he will have to be good to very good LG. But with a stud LT and Bentley at Center that can be achieveable. Contract size will be viewed differently soon.
JMHO
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off! Go Browns! CHRIST HAS RISEN! GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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Our OL is in bad shape becuae of a lack of talent #1 and injuries #2 ... La would have been HUGE .... but everyone else on our OL is below Avg. or just plain PUTRID (pick a gaurd and u have PUTRID) ....
I agree he is the our best OL (but thats REAL REAL SAD and show u just how dire the situation is) ... and prolly 3rd - 5th on our priority list .... it depends on La and how much longer we want to stomach Tuck ....
I alos agree he is no better suited for RT than LT and [color:"white"] tabber [/color] I was with U when we signed the guy ..... hoping we move him inside .. well now after having to suffer through watchign him play he is further from being a gaurd than a tackle ... this boy has ZERO DRIVE BLOCKING ABILITY/POWER .... he hasn;t MOVED anyone all year ...
For us to be an Abv. Avg run blocking OL (sumptin we need in C-town for Dec and Jan) he needs to either be the weakest link or a BACK UP ...
as for his contract ... I think Opie knew we needed sumptin at LT .. and the choices were Shelton or Shaffer .... THERE WAS NO ONE ELSE ... and i when i say no one else .. i mean NO ONE ELSE ... your going to overpay for a LT ... PERIOD END OF STORY .... so Opie went with the young piece of crap with a good work ethic and at least a chance of improving as opposed to the old pice of crap with a HORRIBLE work ethic with no chance of improving ...
Opie also knew we were in GREAT CAP SHAPE so even though it was a roll of the die he had to do it ....
as for next year .... [color:"white"] tabber[/color] if we so much as look at Davis i will start to turn on Opie ... he is another piece of crap .... just like shelton ... great ahteletic ability with ZERO WORK ETHIC ... I wouldnt touch him with a ten foot pole ... so unless we draft Thomas (witch we've prolly all ready won ourselves out of that chance) the best were gonna do is maybe someone like Ryan Harris who is not gonna step in day 1 at LT ... so were prolly looking at least one more year of Shaff ... YUCK!!!!!!!! BUT AS DANGLET SAID ... unfortunatly we have other areas that need improving just as bad or worse including a couple spots on the OL ...
and I would aslo like to see the structure of Shaff's contract .. I'm hoping its a 5 yr. contract thats really only a 3 year contract .... that would make what Opie did even more understandable ..
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It was a 7 year deal. So rounds out to 5 a year but there is probaly a few safety valve roster bonuses included.
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Didnt we give McGinnest 3 year 17 mil? thats the one we should be complaining about lol
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[color:"red"] So as for Savages intent. I think it was for him to play LT until the "Opportunity" arises to get a stud LT - which can or might not happen its a rare opportunity. [/color] And I THINK Phil was hoping that Shaffer's play could delay that for a long while..it hasn't.
[color:"red"]But in your post you define that intent to be LT and only LT due to money. [/color] He got paid LT money initially..not OG money ,not center money..not RT money but LT money..anything well below that would have signaled something else.
[color:"red"]But my point is the value of contracts is going to change dramatically over the next 5 years. so that in 05 thinking what you say is correct. That contract means LT and only LT. What I'm suggesting is that in 08 (when he might got to LG) the money he will be getting will not be considered off the wall high for a good LG. [/color] Yeah, I agree with that...price goes up every year.
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[color:"red"]"as for next year .... tabber if we so much as look at Davis i will start to turn on Opie ... he is another piece of crap .."
[color:"orange"]Sorry...I have now watched him in 4 games with purpose of looking at him and only him. He is playing great. Your 01 evaluations cannot still apply.
I don't know if he's turning it on for a contract year or what. But he is playing Excellent LT...just as good as any of the elite (sure I can count on my hand pure beats he has from a speed rusher) but I have not seen a LT pancake more DEs in a run game than I have seen him in the 4 games I've scrutinized him at.
I've seen him controll the speed rushers to only get beat maybe once a game if at any but the rest having them neutralized barely getting a step forward from the LOS.
I see Arizona letting him go...I see them franchising him.
But they are cheap and might not see the value a stud LT would be opposed to an adequate one cause of the lefty QB.
I have watched and watched before coming out with my evaluation cause I know I would get reamed for it. But I think the light has come on. I think he is a stud.
I would be very very pleased with Savage if he got Davis and only Davis (from the FA market) to take over the LT spot from Shaffer.
As for evaluating Shaffer - believe it or not I have watched him less than Davis as far as scrutinizing his play...so hard for me to say - Never at LG. I'm thinking him bracketed between a Davis and Bentley...you'd be surprised what talent comes from who when surrounded by talent.
But I know I'm right about Leonard Davis...I don't think you have watched him like I have this year. Your evaluation is old time on him. He is studding out.
JMHO
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off! Go Browns! CHRIST HAS RISEN! GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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U ASSume an awful lot about my evaluations of Davis (U think so little of me that I'd speak about his play today now based on 4 years ago .. please .. *L*) ... no need to be sorry ... you can just be wrong .. <img src="/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" />
whoever signs him will be SORRY AS HELL ... watch and see ... and my personal eval of him is no where near A STUD .... and that is based on alot more than 4 games .... as usual time will tell ....
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Thanks for the info on Shaffs contract .... lets hope its a 7 year contract thats really a 4 year contract .. *L* ...
Willies actually played really well the last 3 or 4 games .... he cant rush the passer anymore but he has been really good in his run responsibilities .. alot of times he isnt making the play but hes forcing RB's into someone else ... he is uncanny in knowing when to pinch down as opposed to going wide ... I have yet to see him "squeeze" down the line messing up blocking schemes and clogging holes and the play bounce outside of him .. pretty uncanny if u ask me .. or maybe just luck .. *L*
he was also brought here for other than on the field performance .. hes been great for at least Kameron ... and more than likely DQ and the rest of the youngins that dont[ play LB just by his leadership and ability to teach them what u need to do day in and day out to become winners ..
plus is it a 3 yr. contract thats really a 2 yr. contract??? *L*
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Yep, Willie's numbers are right in line with where they were last year for the Pats.... I'm hoping we can get one more year like this one out of him... he will have served his purpose...
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JC...
I am not going to get into the merits of Shaffers play. What I will say is if our plan is to move him to guard, someone needs to get fired.
As diam said....Shaffer isn't a drive blocker and for the money we paid, we could have got a real guard and more.
Like it or not, Shaffer is our LT for at least 2 more seasons before we can think of anything else without having the highest paid back-up in the league or a dead money hit that would sink any team.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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actually Peenie the cap hit wouldn't even come close to sinking us for 2 reasons ... and No I'm not saying it would be a good thing but the fACT is it wouldn;t sink us ....
1 couple last years purge and 2. the HUGE increase in the overall cap # .. IT WENT UP like 20 mill didnt it?? i think it went from like 60 mill to 80 mill .. but i'm just guessing onthe exact #'s .. anyone know please help me as I am a cluelees wonder here
even with Shaffs hit we'd still be in really good shape .... granted I'd rather have the $$$ to spend in other places but it wouldn't even come close to sinking us ..
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Ok....if you want to get technical.....we would survive...I don't have the bonus numbers, but it had to be pretty healthy.
You start taking hits like that, even if you do it at half year as I am sure they would to be able to spread it over 2 seasons, you are going to create a major cash problem that could create problems with other parts of the team.
I know you can at least agree with that....wait....maybe not....it's me who is talking <img src="/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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[color:"red"] What I will say is if our plan is to move him to guard, someone needs to get fired. [/color] Thats got to be your new clitche..MOVE PLAYER TO ANOTHER POSITION, FIRE SOMEONE..ANYONE..JUST FIRE SOMEONE <img src="/images/graemlins/rofl.gif" alt="" /> Actually as I first said I don't think Phil brought him in with the intent to move KS anywhere..he was hoping he has enough upside to mann the spot for several years ..now think about that..if the team improves every year in wins..how could they possibly be in position to draft high enough to get a franchise OT? They wouldn't unless they are one player away and can move up (leap up) to get in the top five.. U know it's almost impossible to get a franchise FA OT..right? So it's obvious Shaffer was brought in to play the spot not move around. Now his performance might dictate otherwise..if they get a chance to get a OT who's more talented then he is they'll have to make the decision to move the guy.
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The thing is,I don't really disagree.
I see the problem almost as if you have a #1 draft choice at QB....you are almost forced into sticking with the decision for a while....maybe even a while too long.
With the money invested, I just don't see LT as being high on the shopping list at this point.
I might be wrong, but that is just the way I see it.
I think we will see guards brought in....and all sorts of things done before Shaffer is cut or moved to another position.
Again....not saying that is right, just saying that is the reality as I see it.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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Right now thats what I see also..we might all get suprised in the draft. Be nice. But for the moment I will say I see one FA OG, one drafted OG. I don't know how they feel about Nat Dorsey. And depending on how Kelly Butler finishes the season at RT ..lets just say Tucker comes back..they'll probably keep Butler IF ..if he finishes well. If not look for another FA OT.. This isn't a defense thread so I won't comment on that side of the ball in here.
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I really don't see why everybody is so down on Shaffer? Has he been great this year....hell no. But he has not been a bum either. IMO put a good LG (quit laughing) next to him and give him another year and I don't think we will here to many people still bringing his name up when they discuss problems with our O-line
I AM ALWAYS RIGHT... except when I am wrong.
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If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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When it comes to OL you are only as good as the guy next to u and he is playing next to the worst LG in the NFL and I mean worst.
I know the kid has been beaten up because he isnt a super star but I think he can do the job and do it well. Several of his sacks came from pass protection for a 7 step drop and the quarterback taking a 3 step drop.
More trouble has come from Shaffer doing exactly what he supposed to do, Andruzzi is not a very good LG at this point in his career. He never was all that great and the Pats made NO attempt to keep him. Yet, Savage was a genius for "stealing him away from the Pats." <img src="/images/graemlins/rofl.gif" alt="" /> With that said..........Andruzzi is not the problem w/Shaffer. In fact, I have heard from two very reliable people that Shaffer gets more help than any of our offensive linemen. And it isn't close. This actually makes other guys look worse. Let me address Shaffer's game: ---He is very strong. That's a positive. He is unbelievable in the weight room. ---He is slow out of his stance. ---He plays too upright. He does NOT get his chest over his thighs and his balance is often compromised. This is a huge flaw. ---His lateral movement is poor....especially to his left. ---Because his feet are poor, he relies on grabbing w/his hands too much. ---For as strong as he is, he has not perfected an effective punch. ---His technical skills are terrible. He relies on brute strength and he is routinely beat because of technical issues. This leads him to actually asking for help and compromises the play of the rest of the line. I'm sorry........but I think the guy sucks! And while I'm not much of a cap guy.......I do realize that his contract is going to hurt the Browns. He is simply making way more money than he is worth. Of course, his contract almost guarantees we are stuck w/him. [censored].......this [censored] is getting so old. Bottom line: It was a bad signing, no matter what you eternal optimists say.
"What lies behind us and what lies before us are small matters compared to what lies within us." --Ralph Waldo Emerson
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
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With that said..........Andruzzi is not the problem w/Shaffer. In fact, I have heard from two very reliable people that Shaffer gets more help than any of our offensive linemen. And it isn't close. This actually makes other guys look worse.
Let me address Shaffer's game:
---He is very strong. That's a positive. He is unbelievable in the weight room.
---He is slow out of his stance.
---He plays too upright. He does NOT get his chest over his thighs and his balance is often compromised. This is a huge flaw.
---His lateral movement is poor....especially to his left.
---Because his feet are poor, he relies on grabbing w/his hands too much.
---For as strong as he is, he has not perfected an effective punch.
---His technical skills are terrible. He relies on brute strength and he is routinely beat because of technical issues. This leads him to actually asking for help and compromises the play of the rest of the line.
I'm sorry........but I think the guy sucks! And while I'm not much of a cap guy.......I do realize that his contract is going to hurt the Browns. He is simply making way more money than he is worth. Of course, his contract almost guarantees we are stuck w/him. [censored].......this [censored] is getting so old.
Bottom line: It was a bad signing, no matter what you eternal optimists say. You just wait untill Soup here's this!!!! He was in the third row ya know!? Eye level with the field ya know!? He knows what he saw ya know!? <img src="/images/graemlins/rofl.gif" alt="" /> And I know what I see! Yep,he sucks! <img src="/images/graemlins/thumbsup.gif" alt="" />
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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Joined: Sep 2006
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Hall of Famer
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Hall of Famer
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Here's Savage after 11 games, coming off a 30-0 loss to the Bengals: "Kevin Shaffer is playing left tackle right now, and based on the options we had last year, we felt like he was a good choice. There have been stretches this year where he has played pretty good football.
"For the most part, I think he's been adequate." [color:"white"] Yeah, that's exactly what I said on this forum last year, that Shaffer is a "now" left tackle. However, that's not a good endorsement, and I don't give a rats ass about "he hasn't given up a sack in the last 2 games" because it's a load of crap. He's not a starting left tackle in this league, and the sooner he's replaced, the sooner we can move forward. He's got a shot at sticking as a right tackle, but that's it. He's too soft to play guard. Another weak effort by DorKskunk.[/color]
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy. Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 15,188 Likes: 13
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 15,188 Likes: 13 |
thats such a load of crap GM ... U could put Alan Faneca next to him .. that wont make him able to MOVE ANYONE ... and it won't improve his pee poor feet ..
U guys are so far of base when u say put someone next to this guy and makes HIM better ... no it makes the OL better ... but Druzzi/Coleman or even Hank for that matter won't become any better .. they will still ahve the SAME PHYSICAL LIMITATIONS ...
Shaff does not ahve teh SKILL SET to be anything but a BELOW AVG. LT ... and i could care less whos next to him ...
[color:"white"] and Peenie [/color] your still living in the past .. the new TOTAL CAP # is alot more than it used to be ... so like i said ... i would rather not but if we cut Shaff tommorow and ate his entire SB it would not CRIPPLE us at all ..we could still be VERY VERY ACTIVE in FA ..
and the very few time u do make sense and i agree ... i just dont respond .. *L*
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Dawg Talker
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Dawg Talker
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J/C, I'm no OL guru (or any other type of guru) <img src="/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> So I'll just give my honest opinion! I think Shaffer is an average LT, he's looked decent at times and crappy at times. He's the LT we have for now and probably the next season or two; unless we draft Thomas! Personally, I don't think we get Thomas, I think (hope) we get Branch! (Ted's replacement on DL)
I do think that Shaffer could improve, not to greatness but to a higher level of adequacy! Though I don't see him as the long term solution for the LT position, I do think Savage was hoping he would be or at least allow Savage several seasons before having to really address that position.
I think we will replace the Guards and maybe RT depends upon Tucker and his illness! (?) In fact, I think we will get 2 maybe 3 OL via draft and FA, then concentrate on the DL, probably two, 1 FA, and 1 draft! Then we get a CB, probably 1 draft and maybe 1 FA if the price is right! The rest of our draft will probably be for depth, OL, DL, LB's, and maybe a RB! (mid-to-late rd.)
This is just my opinion and does not reflect the views of the board, it's members, or sponsors! <img src="/images/graemlins/rofl.gif" alt="" />
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 27,300 Likes: 637
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 27,300 Likes: 637 |
thats such a load of crap GM Come on big guy, don't hold back tell me how you really feel about Shaffer <img src="/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" />
I AM ALWAYS RIGHT... except when I am wrong.
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Hall of Famer
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Hall of Famer
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Saddly GM, we could send every one of our guys to the Pro-Bowl and people would still complaine about his Feet, his hand size, his first step, or the one sack they gave up in the third quarter of the 9th game of the season....To me Shaffer is still young, 26, first year in the system, yes he has areas he need to improve on, but if he didnt....Well he'd be T.O. <img src="/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />
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Joined: Sep 2006
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Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 39,540 Likes: 984 |
i would rather not but if we cut Shaff tommorow and ate his entire SB it would not CRIPPLE us at all .. Dude....that is a foolish statement. Sure it would. You have to consider that as cap goes up, the going rates go up. To say eating his contract wouldn't hurt is foolish. We might be able to remain active, but it wouldn't for anybody that would answer anything.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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Hall of Famer
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[color:"red"]IMO put a good LG (quit laughing) next to him and give him another year and I don't think we will here to many people still bringing his name up when they discuss problems with our O-line [/color]
GM it's the same thing with any player across the board..we don't have to have a pro-bowler at every position but on the offensive line U want guys who hold their own and whose talents are not dependant on the guy next to them. Putting a better guard next to Shaffer isn't going to make him block better or move laterally better..it just means it's going to help the inside blocking. Shaffer will still have to handle the DE on his side and many times that means he's out on a island by himself as is any LT..
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Joined: Sep 2006
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Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 27,300 Likes: 637 |
and just how many times when he was out on an Island by himself, was he beat, or hurt the team this year??? On average about twice a game, and most other starting LT's are about the same. Is Shaffer a high quality starting LT....NO, but IMO he is just below average as a starting LT in the NFL. Like I said with another year in the system he COULD be an average to above average LT and he is by far better than both of are starting guards right now.
I AM ALWAYS RIGHT... except when I am wrong.
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Joined: Sep 2006
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Hall of Famer
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Hall of Famer
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Seems if U noticed they constantly had a TE on his side to chip the DE. How many neck tackles did he have when he was locked up? <img src="/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" /> Quite a few costly holding penalties.. I even brought this up after a few games and it still holds true..he is slow getting into his stance as he's effective when he gets off his block first and engages the DE.. Now in the running game he isn't overpowering enough to get a consistant push off the line. For him to shoot himself up to average ....he'd have to somehow increase his mobility/lateral movement.. That said, it's probablt going to be this way..unless a franchise type LT falls wherever we're selecting, Phil is going to fill another hole..we'll have to live with Shaffer another year at LT. The OG spots are really horrible..and I see that being attended to first.
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Rookie
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Rookie
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I know the kid has been beaten up because he isnt a super star but I think he can do the job and do it well. Several of his sacks came from pass protection for a 7 step drop and the quarterback taking a 3 step drop. This is an interesting thought, and I kind of wonder how much that went back to Carthon and his schemes. I remember hearing players, even quarterbacks, saying that he was sending in the wrong blocking schemes for plays, and they told him, and Carthon told them to run the play as he said. That falls right in line with this theory. More trouble has come from Shaffer doing exactly what he supposed to do, yet the QB doesnt step up. QB takes one step forward and it isnt a sack, but instead QB trys to go even deeper into his set or takes off a boogying and gets whacked. I truly believe that the chemistry between the LT and the QB is just as important as chemistry between the QB and a WR or TE, A LT gets used to blocking for his quarterback, but if the quarterback isn't moving the way he should, it throws that chemistry off. I take for example the lack of chemistry that Jonathon Ogden and Kyle Boller had. JO would be pushing his guy outside, and rather than Boller stepping up as he should, he would continue to drop, resulting in a sack. Beings this is the 3rd LT in 3 years, and 3rd or 4th QB in 3 years, it is killing that chemistry which is needed.
Finally, The Maskedman has come back, to the true Cleveland Browns Message Board.
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