DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Everything Else... Chief Wahoo Going Bye-Bye

My grandfather was half Indian and I don't find it racist in the least.

Well considering you only care about yourself ultimately, that is not surprising.

Censorship at it's finest!

Which 7/11 did he own?

It is rather funny that a guy who feels the need to post a thread about censorship feels some need to try to compare the KKK to Chief Wahoo in some effort to compare people who have a history of hanging people to those who simply wear a hat with a mascot of a baseball team. Yeah, it's the same thing! lmfao.

Trying to censor people through a false sense of shame.

I do not think Chief Wahoo was racist. With that said I will not miss him. I have always hated Chief Wahoo because I thought it was just silly looking.

I never posted anything about the KKK in this thread.

It was actually this quote by Vers I was referring to....



You see, I had forgotten how Cleveland Indians fans used to dawn their Chief Wahoo gear, gather together and go out and lynch Native Americans which would make these things actually be comparable.

As long as real Indians fans are arouind, the Chief will remain alive.



It's just a logo....good gosh...the creampuffs always get their way of they sniffle long enough.


Creampuffs.

LOL........toughness and wearing the Chief Wahoo gear are one and the same.

You're entitled to your opinion, but your comment drawing equivalence between Chief Wahoo supporters and the KKK was beyond the pale. It was outrageous and ridiculous, and, I would have thought, beneath you.

I agree w/you. I resorted to the same tactics that others are using. I was wrong to do so and I apologize. Not to those dudes, but to guys like you. I'm sorry.

What? It has nothing to do with being tough. It's a charicature. So what? I don't find it insulting in the least.

My Great Great Grandmother was a full blooded Blackhawk. I don't know what part that makes be, but it's some part.

Are you a Cherokee or something?

I'm not a Cream puff, that is for sure, tough guy!

No tough guy here. At least not now, I am near 70. Like it or not, Father Time doesn't stop his count.


It is what it is. Some people have future time. Some have had past time.

I am a Tlingit indian and meh doesn't bother me in the least.

To me it was never racist. It was just a silly happy face that brought up some good memories.

I have yet to meet anyone who is not at least a little racist. Don't think that you are? Be the only white boy in a room full of black boys. Be the only black boy in a room full of white boys. I guarantee you that neither one that is singled out doesn't feel nervous in some way that first time it happens. That's why we have chinatown and koreatown and little tokyo and all the other things we call parts of town where races have segregated themselves. It's a natural instinct to try and fit in and belong. Ethnicity/race is the most identifiable landmark that people rely on when in a group of strangers.

The only cure for it is repeated exposure to diversity with a positive experience. In other words growing a thicker skin to the things that bother you about each other so a chance to develop trust can occur. All this politically correct stuff just creates more division as people become so worried about being offensive that they just avoid each other all together so as not to be stressed over having the "perfect" behavior and words. In other words the actual effect is that PC creates segregation more than it creates acceptance because to get acceptance you have to accept people as they are with flaws and all. Get angry when you're insulted and speak your mind. Ask for forgiveness when you hurt someone. Bump and bruise each other and get the freak over it.

Coach any group of hot headed hids in the summer and you should understand exactly what I mean. Watch them all go home to their segregated communities and you will see what I mean too. Be that only white boy that walks through the projects and see if white people are the only racists. I seriously get sick and tired of all the nonsense and fuss over it.

The biggest dividers in our society is not race. It's education levels, culture, and the expectations we set for the kids growing up. Try being asian and bad at math. It's soul crushing when they are not.

Anyways /rant off

Yet now you cream puffs are doing the bitching and whining because something has went the other way, as you cream puffs always do when you cream puffs dont get your way.

Sorry, you lost this battle, so quit your cry baby BS and man up

I don't care if the logo goes, so I didn't lose anything. I care that people are all bunched up over a logo. Getting rid of logos and statues isn't going to erase bigotry.

I say bigotry because I think everybody is racist in it's pure form to some degree. I think it is pretty normal actually. Bigotry is the problem, not being racist. The world has evolved with pockets of white people, pockets of black people, and pockets of yellow people. I think its because people like to hang with their own. Why hasn't the homogenization of society happend long before this? Probably because we all have differnt tastes in food, music, religion, dress, language, etc. The problems start when one group or the other decide they don't like the other for any number of reasons, and then take steps to hurt the other.

I actually agree with a lot of what you said, even the part about The Chief. I grew up with Cheif Wahoo as an icon in my life. I remember as a little kid when it was a big deal being able to make the trip up to Cleveland to go see an Indians game at old Muni and one of the big things I rememeber is the big Chief Wahoo on the side of Muni.

But, I also try to be fair and understand why some may not care for it .So I am ok either way, if our logo is basically the block C, that doesnt change my memories any.

Seeing the Chief Wahoo sign on the old Municipal Stadium has always a been happy memory from my childhood too ... it can still be found at the Western Reserve Historical Society Museum:

************

Chief Wahoo – Municipal Stadium

Chief Wahoo, a larger-than-life feature of the WRHS Reinberger gallery, appears in full light once again thanks to the generosity of interested Indians fans committed to the preservation of Cleveland baseball memorabilia.

The 28-foot-high logo of the Cleveland Indians, as wide as he is tall, was donated to WRHS in 1994 when the team moved from Municipal Stadium to (then) Jacob’s Field. Brilliant Sign Company of Cleveland made and installed the huge Wahoo above Municipal’s Gate D in 1962. Many recognize it from the opening scenes of the film Major League, as the shot pans the stadium.

Some people then, and now, criticize the team for using this caricatured logo, but it is undoubtedly part of Cleveland’s history and current culture. Most recently, the sign was the focus of an ESPN story on the controversy around the logo.

Indians fans, including the WRHS Women’s Advisory Council, raised funds to restore and install Wahoo in the WRHS facility in University Circle in 1994. About two years ago, Wahoo’s face dimmed; the lights illuminating his oversized head had gone out. Our thanks to the latest fans who stepped up to the plate (and wish to remain anonymous) for providing the $1,500 to keep Wahoo in shape.



https://www.wrhs.org/explore/exhibits/chief-wahoo-exhibit/

I remember seeing this every Sunday morning during the drive from Lakewood to St. Nicholas church on E. 36th.

To me as a kid, a passionate shrine of Cleveland.

Lots of great memories in that place as a young teen. At 12/13 used to catch the RTA bus from the near west side with $5 in our pocket and for $5 got bus fare both ways ($.85c each way) and get a $3 jr general admission ticket. Corey Snyder, Brook Jacoby, Joe Carter , Pat Tabler. Greg Swindell was my role model. Saw Sandy Alomars first at bat as an Indian, had my first job selling concessions at 16. Was there the night Canseco had the ball bounve off his head and over the fence.

After all, it seems as though a lot of people still call it The Jake.

Court & Justice

Anti-Chief Wahoo activist charged with misusing federal grant money meant for Native Americans

August 30, 2017
By Eric Heisig, cleveland.com

CLEVELAND, Ohio -- A well-known anti-Chief Wahoo activist was indicted in federal court Wednesday and charged with stealing more than $77,000 in grant money meant to benefit Native Americans in Northeast Ohio.

Robert Roche, 70, faces charges of conspiracy and two counts of theft of government funds. His indictment comes after a multi-year investigation by the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services.

The U.S. Attorney's Office says Roche, a Cleveland resident, worked with consultant Craig McGuire to steal money from the Parma-based American Indian Education Center. Roche is the executive director of the nonprofit, which was established in 1995.

Roche obtained a grant in 2011 through the Substance Abuse and Mental Health Services Administration. The "Circle of Care" grant was supposed to support mental health and wellness programs for Native American children and families, according to the indictment.

SAMHSA awarded Roche's nonprofit more than $302,340 for fiscal year 2012 and $308,040 in fiscal year 2013. Prosecutors said Roche and Craig McGuire, a consultant he hired as a grant writer, embezzled a combined $183,703.55 from the grant money.

Roche's nonprofit received $482,766 from SAMHSA from 2011 through 2013 and did not get all the money awarded to it because SAMHSA placed it in "high risk" status, the indictment says.

Prosecutors said Roche paid himself by classifying himself as a project coordinator of the programs funded by the grant, even though the grant's regulations precluded him from doing so. The grant applications also identified another person as the project coordinator, according to the indictment.

The grant applications also had several false statements, including a claim the center had a wellness department and a "Positive Paths" after-school program, prosecutors said. It fraudulently listed people the center allegedly employed and mischaracterized the description of the center's building and physical amenities, prosecutors said.

"Mr. Roche took tens of thousands of dollars earmarked for Native American children and families and put the money in his own pockets," U.S. Attorney Justin Herdman said in a news release.

Reached by cellphone on Wednesday afternoon, Roche referred questions to his attorney Larry Zukerman. Zukerman said he would discuss the case after Roche is arraigned.

Roche has been a vocal advocate for the need for more resources for Native Americans. He has also been a well-known face in the movement to rid Cleveland of Chief Wahoo, the controversial mascot of the Indians.

McGuire, of Lewis Center, pleaded guilty to federal charges in April. Prosecutors said Roche paid McGuire with grant money, which is prohibited by federal rules.

He has agreed to cooperate with the government's investigation and to testify at trial if asked. If he does what he is asked, he could face a sentence of between eight and 14 months in federal prison.


http://www.cleveland.com/court-justice/index.ssf/2017/08/anti-chief_wahoo_activist_char_1.html

It’s sad that there’s so many suckers who don’t realize these various "causes" and protests are fueled my shysters looking to make a buck.



HELP GET RID OF THE "BROWNIE"!



Get Rid of Racist Images Foundation
rockyhilldawg
P.O. Box 4y32
Rocky Hill, CT 06067

Me!! and the Q is still Gund Arena

Please do this. I will do a counter protest and hopefully we can bring back the brownie. Hopefully the variant with the crown on its head. We at least need to be the king of the Brownies. Also what gender is the brownie? do Scottish fairies have genders?

I am surprised that fairies isn't a banned word.

Yeah fairies wear boots, and you gotta believe me
Yeah, I saw it, I saw it I tell you no lies

Gotta love a good Ozzy reference!

I figured the Chief would be removed in our lifetimes, but I'd bet the Redskins name endures. A logo is "easy" to replace, especially since it's not even the Indians main logo.

I'm sure once we get rid of Wahoo, Redskins,Statues, Confederate flags, Police and of course all Conservitives then all will right in the world.

Basketball is less diverse, but no one is bringing that up now are they?

almost as stupid as being upset about a cartoon logo, no? if its not a big deal and stupid, no issue keeping it

I am American Indian (umpqua tribe)

I don't like the name redskins - wish I looked like the logo - I do have the rugged good looks, but just a fatter version :-)

The Indians logo, I don't like ...... name doesn't bother me - I think you can use historical ethnic groups (even marginalized ones) in a positive way (SI did a great story on how the seminoles keep their history alive with help from FSU)

I vote with my dollars

I am not Native American, but I completely agree w/your takes on the names and logos.

Well, they did make the Washington Bullets change their name.

What in the hell happened in here??? People got quiet as hell when Robert Roche Stole 77,000 bucks from the folks who he ACTED like he was so worried about. IF he is found guilty (which I am not saying he is yet) Then this is a total screw up on the part of those who want to cry about this crap.