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he looked like an angry and bitching Eric Cartman...and had that loser face on him...for a guy preaching "team" and "character" he sure didn't behave that way himself...as a leader...in a stressful situation
What's he supposed to do, django? Clap 'em on the back, or stare at the ground like RAC, with his hands on his hips? Come on, man.
Why don't we give him time before you run him outta Cleveland, like say, more time than one pre-season game?
I want an ass-kicking, anal-retentive coach. The best coaches are precisely that way. Ryan can be a beer-swilling, aw-shucks good-time player-friendly coach in NY, cuz I don't care what the Jets do.
And comparing him to Botch isn't close to being fair, not at this juncture.
![[Linked Image from i28.photobucket.com]](http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c201/shadedog/mcenroe2.jpg) gmstrong -----------------
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By the way Django, haven't you seen any of the good remarks from former players? Selective process for the desired effect 
Players not on his payroll? I'm interested...
as to his behaviour mid-game...it was simply arrogant and fully selfish...he didn't yell or try to motivate...he just quit on his team and you could see it and his team quit playing for him...I wasn't the only one seeing this as I remember a post from Vers on th eother board alluding to this...he just looked like a big fat loser....Eric Cartman who didn't get the candy he so much deserves from HIS team
Also, you guys say you listen to his pressers, right? How many times he talks about "communicating", "what can we do better, where"/"why didn't that work" etc....you hear this...and then read what his former FS and leader of the D has to say, Rhodes...he basically said that he didn't take any criticism and players feared speaking their minds....guy's a double-faced smart guy, knows football...too bad he lacks social skills though....it was his demise in NY and it will be again here, for the sake of the Browns...I hope I'm wrong but I pretty sure he won't get us anywhere important, he's just the anti-RAC and will be as successful
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Everyone is not going to like the head coach... Some will.. Some won't... but the important thing is this....
If the players win... the coach looks like a genius... If the players lose... the coach looks like an idiot...
Point taken: The players must play well... I could care less about a coach at this point.
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In all honesty I'm not focusing on Mangini. My problem is with Randy Lerner. Thus far he has NOT shown me he can hire the right people. If this keeps up.. I want a new owner. We've been in the league since 1999. Its time to show some results.
It's past time.
SaintDawg™
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In all honesty I'm not focusing on Mangini. My problem is with Randy Lerner. Thus far he has NOT shown me he can hire the right people. If this keeps up.. I want a new owner. We've been in the league since 1999. Its time to show some results.
It's past time.
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Finally : Someone jumps over to my side ( the dark side ) .. I said from day one , and have continued to comment , on how the NFL. stuck it to us with the Lerner's ..We could have had the Shula Group 
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BEREA, Ohio -- So some of the New York Jets are glad that Eric Mangini is gone. Does this really come as a surprise? Is any Jets player in training camp with new coach Rex Ryan going to say, "I just miss Mangini"? Fact is that some Jet players appreciated the current Browns coach, and some probably couldn't stand him. "You can say what you want and speak your mind," safety Kerry Rhodes told the Los Angeles Times. "I think it's always best if you can do that, because if you don't, you can end up holding so much stuff in that at the end of the day it can be combustible. That's how we ended up with the last coach." Or as guard Damien Woody told the paper: "Here I am 31 years old, I've got my own kids, and I'm married, and here's someone that's not that much older than me -- or whatever the case may be -- telling me what I can and can't do...It's so regimented where the game is just not a game anymore. It's not fun. Even when you win it's not fun." Let's take a peek in the rearview mirror back at the four years of Romeo Crennel. The players said they liked him. They said he treated them "like men." But did they respect him enough to listen to him? The Browns were 6-10, 4-12, 10-6 and 4-12 in Crennel's four years. In the final season of Butch Davis and interim coach Terry Robiskie, they were 4-12. Being 4-12 in the NFL is like losing 100 games in baseball. And the Browns did it in three of the last five years! If you are going to fire a "players coach" in Crennel, why hire the same type as his replacement? Just as in New York, if you are going to dump Mangini, then why bring in the same personality in the next coach? To be fair to Mangini, a jumbo-jet load of his former New York players have joined him in Cleveland. Everyone must not have hated him. But this is about Mangini in Cleveland, not what happened in New York. It's about how something has been terribly wrong in Browns town. Not all of it was coaching, but that was a factor. The Browns were one of the league's most penalized teams in the last three years. Over the last three seasons with the Jets, Mangini's teams had the NFL's fewest penalties. But it's going to take him more than one training camp and one preseason game to clean up this mess. Two key penalties (Hank Fraley's hold and Corey Ivy's pass interference) cost the team 10 points in the dismal 17-0 loss to Green Bay. At least the coaching staff offered no excuses for the mistakes, and the offenders were running at the next practice. You can bet some of the players thought they are being treated like kids by the Mangini regime. So what? This has been a losing, sloppy, undisciplined team. Who knows if Mangini's approach will be successful? But the old way wasn't working. If the players don't like how he's pushing and coaching them right now -- I really don't care. link
I am unfamiliar with this feeling of optimism
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Maybe DjangoBrown needs to read it..no one s suggesting that Mang is this loving HC..but this team needs discipline...Rac didn't run a tight enough ship and often didn't seem to know what to do..
There's a middle ground..some like Mangini..some don't..at this point I'm tired of going through new coaches and GM's and no change in the product..instead of U crying and moaning Django..give the guy a chance and then spout he's a failure..
Last edited by Attack Dawg; 08/19/09 08:28 AM.
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I read this yesterday. I'm kind of in the middle. On one hand, these players, especially OUR players, need discipline, discipline, and then some more discipline. It's FOOTBALL people. Be tough and stop whining. On the other hand, Mangini doesn't seem to be helping himself w/ his personality. In press conferences I'd swear he's a robot. I don't necessarily want him giving everybody hugs every morning, but he seems like he might benefit from learning from criticizm and not distance himself too far, emotionally, from the players. On a different note, I swear Mangini can't catch a break. Everybody seems to rag on him. This morning on Mike & Mike, some local media guy who covers the Vikings was saying Favre's injury could have been avoided had Mangini had him throw less last season. Good LORD . . . 
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You can bet some of the players thought they are being treated like kids by the Mangini regime.
Maybe if they started playing like football players, Mangini wouldnt have to yell & treat them like kids,
Stop Crying and play football, Act like a man & you'll be treated like a man.
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"Here I am 31 years old, I've got my own kids, and I'm married,
Hey Woody, having those things dosent make you a man.
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If the players don't like how he's pushing and coaching them right now -- I really don't care.
Here either, If any player dosent like it, leave we dont want you here, enough of the whinners, cry babies, that bring thier crappy attitude to Cleveland, leave multi millonaires, and were left with 4-12 & 3-13 records. That right thier is one of the main reasons Pittsburgh beat our a...... every year, They work, work hard, thier tuff physically & mentally, you play for Pittsburgh you know your gonna work and do it one way and it ant your way, they bring in those type of players and get rid of the weak, we need to do that, players need to know if your going to play for Cleveland your gonna work, work hard, but if you do that the rewards far out way the pain. Pittsburgh knows that they do that we need to do that or we will just keep having soft teams that cant stop the run.
I'm so tired of hearing this Mangini is to hard on us crap, I hope he cuts the next guy who cry's, I dont care who it is.
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J/K
Bill Parcells, Bill Bilachek, Tom Coughlin are not great Media personality's i'm sure if Mangin wins in Cleveland, his personality is gonna be just what Cleveland needed, nobody is gonna write during a 13-3 or a 12-4 season about how Mangini treated them at a press confrence.
Mangini wins, his personality will not matter, Parcells & others had close to the same personality's they were proven winners, it was excepted, it was ok becuase they won.
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This morning on Mike & Mike, some local media guy who covers the Vikings was saying Favre's injury could have been avoided had Mangini had him throw less last season.
Yeah, I guess it's sound policy to stop throwing the ball so your QB doesn't hurt his arm. But, then again, if you run the ball more, your RB is going to hurt his legs. So therefore, you can't run or pass. But if you punt, your punter will have a sore leg. Might as well just forfeit.
Personally, I like the rigid discipline. Now, you do have to find some sort of middle ground so you're not driving your guys into the ground.
But Braylon talking about needing some positive reinforcement, and guys getting sloppy in practice is inexcusable. There's probably a lot of coaches out there who, when it's hot and the guys are sloppy would say "alright, let's pack it up and try again tomorrow." I want a coach who says "you either do it right right now, or I'm going to keep you out here in the heat doing these monotonous drills until you get it right."
It's better to work hard and get something done right than muddle through, do it half-assed and then try to make up for it later.
JMHO
I am unfamiliar with this feeling of optimism
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Meanwhile, the Jets were the #1 rushing team in the AFC.
How much less could Favre have thrown?
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Those are two players' opinions. Meanwhile half of our roster ( ) played under Mangini last year and came here as free agents. They must not hate him too much.
And quite frankly, I don't care if the players like Mangini. They have to respect him, but I don't care if they "like" him.
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What I really care about is getting more talent on this team and getting the players who are here to actually play some freaking ball....
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I personally like the basic training treatment for these guys. Not the way butch did it all the time but using the philosophy of EVERYTHING is EARNED.
Give more as they earn more if they start to slip crack the whip. So far they havent earned a hell of a lot.
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Agree...this clowns have had it too easy and haven't been worried about losing their jobs..they need to earn it..this softness they have has got to be rooted out..
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Just clicking
How much will any of this matter if we start to win? And if we do indeed start to win,, will any of us care whether or not his former players liked him? For that matter, if they start to win, what will we think of his current players if they speak against him?
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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I really don't care how many of his former players didn't like him..quite a few did because they're here..Again what I want to see is wins and a improved team..
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Mangini coached under Bellichick and got promoted from DB coach to DC to HC BECAUSE of the cheating...he KNEW they were cheating but didn't say anything because he obviously profited from it...then he turned around and snitched on his master once he became a HC and his ego was bigger than his belly ....that's as double-faced as it gets
I need to quote this because I've heard this so much regarding Mangini, and to a lesser extent Romeo. IIRC, PFT harped on it a lot.. Mangini was the beneficiary of spygate or whatever and parlayed that into a head coaching job.
Now, I happen to think that entire thing was overblown but this isn't the place for that. There's something else that to me is so stupidly simple that it makes me think I'M the one that's missing it.
The pats were stealing defensive signals, meaning reading other teams defenses. So if any coaches were the direct beneficiary of it, it would be the offensive coaches (read: Charlie Weis).
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Just clicking
How much will any of this matter if we start to win? And if we do indeed start to win,, will any of us care whether or not his former players liked him? For that matter, if they start to win, what will we think of his current players if they speak against him?
There were so many players who hate Belichick during his time here ...... there were even complaints about him when he first got to New England .......
Think anyone's complaining today? 
As for fans ...... well, fans hated Belichick ....... and now he's acknowledged as one of the best coaches of all time ..... so go figure.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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As for fans ...... well, fans hated Belichick ....... and now he's acknowledged as one of the best coaches of all time ..... so go figure.
Funny how bringing 3 - 4 Super Bowl trophy's home can change a coach from hated to brilliant.
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As for fans ...... well, fans hated Belichick ....... and now he's acknowledged as one of the best coaches of all time ..... so go figure.
Funny how bringing 3 - 4 Super Bowl trophy's home can change a coach from hated to brilliant.
that has to just be a coincidence...
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I don't hate the man, but he is not my first choice beer-drinkin' buddy either,...and I agree he is brilliant. And he wouldn't be so "hated" if he had won 3-4 Super Bowls here either. He just cut some teeth in Cleveland, probably learned how NOT to do a lot of things. As for Mangini, he gets at least this year from me,....I gave RAC FOUR,...
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As for Mangini, he gets at least this year from me,....I gave RAC FOUR,...
Giving RAC four years is like being a Heroin junky for four years. You don't get better the day you put down the needle. You have to feel worse for awhile before you can start to feel better.
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"Yes, I'm still PO we hired this guy...and this article doesn't make me feel better....oh, and to all the cheerleaders...here is your article to my argument"
Yes, you are better than Mangini.... 
Have you no shame  Do you know who WOODY is and why the Pats let him go even though he had proven to be very proficient at his task? Attitude, so you go as your PROOF that Mangini cannot lead by something stated by WOODY a player with a history of being a MALCONTENT - 
And the many surrounding Mangini...player and coaches who state he is a natural LEADER.
And what of his moniker bestowed on him - "mangenius" Were there circumstances that actually happened for the media to bestow that on him? Only until the combo of a losing season with the disatisfaction from the media that somebody "RATTED" on a fellow coach. Regardless if it was that coach who actually was breaking the rules not Mangini...but he lost the Media. Forever? nah...just until he wins a championship season with us
1. His camps are no where as hard as they were in 06 with the Jets.
2. His losing season most definitely had the grumbling of the Jets collectively regarding his harsh discipline in 07
3. He adjusted his camp and although still kept it disciplined made it more fun and brought new life to the Jets. They bombed in the stretch of 08, not because he lost the team, but directly on the play of one player.
4. Living in NY the owner of the JETS is a true Bozo - I laugh when some here are disgruntled with Randy... When Cowher turned us down and made some overtures that he could be convinced to lead the Jets. To the point that they had a scheduled meeting and Johnson was so sure he would come out of the meeting with Cowher at the helm...he wanted to go into the meeting showing Cowher how serious he was and sure that the Jets were the team for him...HE FIRED MANGINI.
5. The guy was left with his stuck where the sun don't shine as Cowher didn't even want to meet.
This is pretty much how it went down...I lived it and saw it and formed my OPINION on this happening - BEFORE Mangini became a Brown. Cause it all happened before Mangini's meeting with Randy...actually at the time Randy was meeting with Pioli and all thought that was a done deal and there was no word of Mangini being linked with the Browns. So no Homerism involved in the conception of my opinion.
One freakin loss and bad play (recognized by all especially Mangini) and all of a sudden we forget the positives of Discipline.
We forget the vast majority of ex-players and ex-Browns who stated Mangini is exactly what the Browns needed and lacked...Discipline!
But all the chicken littles are ready to throw him under the bus cause I guess it makes them feel smart running around...  I told you so....I told you so
Not so fast - Oh great Board GMs whose vast experience of fantasy football and Mock drafts have given them the imagination of greatness...lol 
How bout we give him - not ONE PRESEASON game - but how bout a season or two. My goodness, Its one freaking Preseason Game!!
Ungabelievable
JMHO
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
Go Browns!
CHRIST HAS RISEN!
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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I think what a lot of people are missing in this debate on Mangini's personality is all of the assistant coaches. Nobody is good at everything and for a staff to work, you need some who encourage and pump up and teach, you need others who listen and understand and you need others who take the hard line and enforce discipline...... Somehow all of that has to be blended into a good coaching staff and only time will tell if we have it.
yebat' Putin
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Tabbie,
When you write this please make sure you mention me by name. I have zero problems backing myself up. I have issues with Randy Lerner and the Lerner family. I have yet to see a quality hire by Randy. Hopefully Mangini proves me wrong.
Until then I remain a board genius and a guru.
SaintDawg™
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Tabbie,
When you write this please make sure you mention me by name. I have zero problems backing myself up. I have issues with Randy Lerner and the Lerner family. I have yet to see a quality hire by Randy. Hopefully Mangini proves me wrong.
Until then I remain a board genius and a guru.
Relax, Saint it's only been 10 years of lousy football.It's not like the 40 years of Bidwell ownership or anything. Randy Loser got it right this time.Just look at his soccer team. I'll bet maybe we score a TD before the preseason is over. Manginis playing it cool. Just imagine the panic the Lions are feeling not knowing which QB will be leading our offense this week.Give them a chance.
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Have you no shame Do you know who WOODY is and why the Pats let him go even though he had proven to be very proficient at his task? Attitude, so you go as your PROOF that Mangini cannot lead by something stated by WOODY a player with a history of being a MALCONTENT -
And the many surrounding Mangini...player and coaches who state he is a natural LEADER.
That's what he'd like to be...you don't gain respect through fear, you just become a clown...think Eric Cartman shouting "Respect my AUTHORITY!!!"...do you know Rhodes EO? Mangini's poster child late round overachiever turned above avg starting FS? Did you read what he had to say? Of course you're "the leader" when you walk around camp swinging your whips...too bad you just "silence" what players think of you doing so...the art of leading is letting your players know you've got whips but without ever showing them off
oh and to your 1.-5. if you truly belive that garbage
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it's a coaching style...you don't like it, that's fine. but, it has proven to work in other places (Coughlin, Parcells, Cowher, Belicheck, or going back to Paul Brown or Vince Lombardi). don't know if it will work for him here, it's all a matter of how much we win and if the players see results.
win and you're a genius, lose and you're a dunce. doesn't matter how you get there either way, that's the nature of the NFL.
#gmstrong
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just clicking,
We were soft.
we did lack dicipline.
we showed little heart or emotion from our old coach.
I was not excited by the specific selection of Mangini, but I was happy that we finaly got a coach that is documented as the anti above points.
You tag that with the fact that he's not an actual rookie Headcoach and it is even better. First non rookie pro head coach in over 10 years.
I'm willing to give him some time before I let the board sway me with its sky is falling 'tude
"He who buys what he does not need steals from himself."
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First non rookie pro head coach in over 10 years.
In the history of the Cleveland Browns which head coach had prior head coaching experience before joining the Browns in that capacity?
#gmstrong
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eeehh, ddubbia, you get my point. lets not knit pick. If Palmer, Davis or Romeo had succeeded all would be fine. but ten years later we need someone who not on his first tour with the big whistle.
If anything these young players need to believe. Eric may succeed or fail, but ifyour paying attention, I don't think you could say he doesn't have a plan.
That's atleast a start for these kids.
Last edited by RocDawg; 08/20/09 07:54 PM.
"He who buys what he does not need steals from himself."
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First non rookie pro head coach in over 10 years.
In the history of the Cleveland Browns which head coach had prior head coaching experience before joining the Browns in that capacity?
Nick Skorich
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